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OSAS #55348
Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:25 AM
Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:25 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,578
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
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Tom  Offline OP
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OSAS
One of the things over the years that the Highway has taught me is to be a bit nitpicky. Of course I have still got a lot learn in that regard, but...
This is equally true when I am talking about OSAS and the Perseverance of the Saints. I do so in this particular case because when a non-Calvinist who claims to believe in OSAS; for the most part do not believe in the Perseverance of the Saints.
Unfortunately however, this nitpickiness has got me in hot water with a group of Calvinists who took issue with me. Saying things like:
Quote
Tom Hardy, the misuse or abuse of a term does not render it false, misleading or inaccurate

I emphasized how the Perseverance of the Saints is a two sided coin; while OSAS is a one sided coin.
While agreeing with me that the Perseverance of the Saints is a two sided coin. They insist that OSAS has been stolen and misrepresented; therefore my nitpickiness has no bearing in the conversation.
I told them if they want to use the term OSAS, they better qualify it; mainly because if they do not do so those who affirm OSAS, but not the Perseverance of the Saints will think you are agreeing with them. I then told them, there are many non-Calvinist Baptists who reject all 5 points of TULIP, yet embrace OSAS. However, they keep going back to their point.
I am actually really surprised, because for the most part we usually agree with each other.
Any thoughts that might be helpful would be appreciated.

Tom

Re: OSAS [Re: Tom] #55352
Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:53 PM
Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:53 PM
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Pilgrim Offline

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These might be helpful:

1. DEFINE the term OSAS as YOU understand it and/or how non-Calvinists define it.
2. Show how the view, OSAS held by non-Calvinists (and some professing Calvinists) is clearly incompatible with the biblical teaching of the "Perseverance/Preservation of the Saints".

If that results in nothing positive.... shake the dust of your sandals and move on. grin

[note] Rarely, if even ever have I personally ever heard a Calvinist use the term OSAS other than in a pejorative sense.


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Re: OSAS [Re: Tom] #55356
Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:42 AM
Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:42 AM
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Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
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Pilgrim
I have been basically trying to do both your points all along. I have also recently said something along the same lines as your note.

However, I was thinking of doing is looking for a good article that covers these issues.
So far however, to my surprise using Google, I am coming up empty.
In fact several hits actually said that OSAS and Perseverance of the Saints are used interchangibly.
I found out that it is 'Freewill Baptists' that believe in OSAS, but do not believe in perseverance of the Saints; but I haven't really found anything that is worth using.
Do you know of an article, that shows these things. Or even a quote from someone like Spurgeon that shows this?

Re: OSAS [Re: Tom] #55370
Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:55 PM
Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:55 PM
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Pilgrim Offline

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Originally Posted by Tom
Do you know of an article, that shows these things. Or even a quote from someone like Spurgeon that shows this?

1. Perseverance of the Saints

2. Will the Unholy Be Saved?

3. Perseverance


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Re: OSAS [Re: Pilgrim] #55375
Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:00 AM
Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:00 AM
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Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
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Tom  Offline OP
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Pilgrim
Thank you for these excellent articles.
All of them are helpful, but I think Ian Murray's article touches the most on the issue that I was enquiring about.

I just posted Ian Murray's article. However, I suspect that although they will agree with Dr. Murray against Kendall's book; because they believe in the Perseverance of the Saints. However, if they are consistent with their arguement so far. They will insist that people like Kendall have stollen OSAS from Calvinists.
I am not sure where they got the idea that OSAS was stollen from Calvinists. They keep making that statement without showing me proof. Although, I did notice a link to something Matt Slick said concerning OSAS and Perseverance of the Saints being used synonymously. However, he didn't back up that statement.

Thanks again
Tom


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