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Pilgrim
Pilgrim
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Hypostatic Union Question #56401
Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:03 PM
Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:03 PM
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Tom Offline OP
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I heard someone say the following concerning the hypostatic union.

Quote
It's essentially that Christ had a human body but a divine mind. It denies the hypostatic union


Is this a logical conclusion?

As I think about this statement (if I understand what he is getting at). It appears that he is denying the fact that Christ had a mind just like any human being, Hebrews 5:8 indicates that Jesus learned obedience through suffering. It would seem that if this person was correct, it would mean that his "divine mind", could learn something from suffering.

Am I understanding the matter properly?

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:18 PM.
Re: Hypostatic Union Question [Re: Tom] #56402
Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:00 PM
Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:00 PM
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The premise is 100% false. The Messiah, the incarnate Son of God took upon Himself humanity, i.e., He was 100% human and 100% Divine. The premise given contradicts the biblical teaching and that which the church has officially held since 451 A.D. It conflicts the two natures which amounts to a human divinity (god) or a divine human, both which are damnable heresy.

Quote
This creed was adopted at the Fourth Ecumenical Council, held at Chalcedon, located in what is now Turkey, in 451, as a response to certain heretical views concerning the nature of Christ. It established the orthodox view that Christ has two natures (human and divine) that are unified in one person.

Therefore, following the holy fathers, we all with one accord teach men to acknowledge one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, at once complete in Godhead and complete in manhood, truly God and truly man, consisting also of a reasonable soul and body; of one substance with the Father as regards his Godhead, and at the same time of one substance with us as regards his manhood; like us in all respects, apart from sin; as regards his Godhead, begotten of the Father before the ages, but yet as regards his manhood begotten, for us men and for our salvation, of Mary the Virgin, the God-bearer; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, Only-begotten, recognized in two natures, without confusion, without change, without division, without separation; the distinction of natures being in no way annulled by the union, but rather the characteristics of each nature being preserved and coming together to form one person and subsistence, not as parted or separated into two persons, but one and the same Son and Only-begotten God the Word, Lord Jesus Christ; even as the prophets from earliest times spoke of him, and our Lord Jesus Christ himself taught us, and the creed of the fathers has handed down to us.


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Re: Hypostatic Union Question [Re: Pilgrim] #56403
Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:41 PM
Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:41 PM
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Tom Offline OP
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Pilgrim

Thank you for answering me so quick.
Would you then agree with what I said earlier?

Quote
As I think about this statement (if I understand what he is getting at). It appears that he is denying the fact that Christ had a mind just like any human being, Hebrews 5:8 indicates that Jesus learned obedience through suffering. It would seem that if this person was correct, it would mean that his "divine mind", could learn something from suffering.


I ask that, because on a subject such as this one, I want to be sure I understand it.

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:43 PM.
Re: Hypostatic Union Question [Re: Tom] #56404
Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:14 AM
Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:14 AM
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Yes, basically I find your statement is acceptable. Do YOU understand what you wrote and the implications of what this person allegedly believes concerning the person of the LORD Christ? For example, IF this person truly believes that the incarnate Son of God only had a "divine mind" and not a human mind, i.e., the actual mind of God; speaking anthropomorphically for God does not have a physical brain like those of all that God created, then if there is but one microscopic bit of knowledge which the Christ had to LEARN, that would incontrovertibly mean that He was not and COULD NOT be God because the one true God is Omniscient; He knows ALL THINGS for He decreed ALL THINGS.


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Re: Hypostatic Union Question [Re: Pilgrim] #56405
Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:08 PM
Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:08 PM
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Tom Offline OP
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Yes Pilgrim I think I understanding the issue.

Apparently, this is called apollinarianism and the person I was referring to is William Lain Craig, who claims to be “neo-apollinarian”.
I heard that WLC is a Molinist, but I did not know about that.
I am just wondering why WLC is held in such high esteem?

I thought I would check this out a little more, mainly because the information was second hand.
https://www.reasonablefaith.org/med...-dr.-craig-have-an-orthodox-christology/


Tom

Last edited by Tom; Thu Oct 22, 2020 7:38 PM.
Re: Hypostatic Union Question [Re: Tom] #56406
Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:40 PM
Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:40 PM
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1. WLC is well-known by some and his "Middle Knowledge" and "Molinarianism" has been discussed on this board several times.

2. Like most all heretics, he muddies the water, confesses orthodoxy, demands tolerance and latitude of differing views, and redefines terms which is not openly revealed to others, thus being guilty of deceit among other things.

My estimation of the man is that he is guilty of damnable heresy and has no part of the true people of God. Just consider what he wrote in the link you provided:

Originally Posted by William Lane Craig
1. We agree with the Council of Chalcedon that in Christ we have one person with two natures – human and divine.

2. The soul of the human nature of Christ is the second person of the Trinity, the Logos. The human nature of Christ is composed of the Logos and a human body.

A. He does NOT agree with the Council of Chalcedon. Just read his second statement which is a perfect example of what I write above re: the modus operandi of heretics.

B. In the incarnation there was the joining of two distinct and separate natures; one being the second person of the Trinity; the Son, and Jesus of Nazareth who was a complete human; body and soul. The Son of God was NOT the soul of the human Jesus. This is a flat contradiction of Scripture and the teaching of the Chalcedon Creed.

Avoid philosophers at all costs. They have no use for absolute truth, but only relativity found in their own musings. Scripture is the sole and final authority in all matters of faith and practice.

Lastly, those who hold WLC in high esteem are likewise to be avoided at all cost. flee


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Re: Hypostatic Union Question [Re: Pilgrim] #56407
Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:57 PM
Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:57 PM
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Tom Offline OP
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Pilgrim

Quote
Avoid philosophers at all costs.


That reminds me of a discussion a friend and I had today about WLC. He told me that WLC is "more committed to being philosophical than theological."

I told my friend that the way I see it, you must be grounded in theology to do philosophy. He said: "WLC, has explicitly said the exact opposite."

All that to say I agree with you.

Tom


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