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Tom
Kelowna, British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 4,893
Joined: April 2001
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#28221
Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:06 PM
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,615
Needs to get a Life
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Needs to get a Life
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,615 |
As 1 Cor. 15:45-49 states, we have better Adam. Unlike the first Adam, the second Adam was perfectly holy and incapable of sin. Yes, Christ suffered temptation, hunger, thrist, and pressure expel gases. But sin is not an essential attribute of man. Christ was and remains 100% man though incapable of sin. We will be incapable of sin yet we will remain men. Yes, Christ is the BETTER ADAM, but this does not mean He was not able to sin. He is BETTER because unlike the first Adam, He did not sin. He, unlike the first Adam fulfilled the covenant/law of God. He, Christ, though like the first Adam and capable of sin, sinned not. Read what RC Sproul wrote here. Speratus then you further your misunderstanding by stating, “But sin is not an essential attribute of man.” And who said it was, especially of Christ? Sin was not an essential attribute to the first Adam before the fall either, but depravity was to man after the fall. You are assuming when we say that one is capable of sinning that he is in some way depraved, which is not true! To stir clear of this heresy, Paul refers to Christ as the “last Adam” (1 Cor 15:45) and the “second man” (1 Cor 15:47). He could have used many phrases if he was just referring to a mere man after the fall, however Paul is referring to Christ’s nature that is similar to the first Adam (before his fall) and thus his wording…. Christ the second Adam was actually capable of sin as the first Adam was (which is not evil—Gen 1:31) and overcame its genuine temptation. If there is no capability to sin then there was not actual temptation. Your position remains un-provable from Scripture—Ad Afontes, Ad Fontes, Speratus. Neither you nor Pligrim wish to deal with the implications of Peccability. There are only two options: 1.If Christ is capable of sin, then He can not offer man that which He is lacking Himself. Resurrected and glorified man remains capable of sin forever. So much for eternal security! Once again you separate the natures of Christ to the destruction of proper theology and a proper understanding of the Person and Work of Christ. Once again you deny the Scriptures which state that we will have a new nature—(1 Cor 15:42f). Once again you do not embrace the glorified Christ in Heaven. Man in his resurrected state will be incapable of sin ( non posse peccare)—this is not even in question! 2. If Christ earns His own personal Impeccability through His perfect obediance and death, it still would not apply to us since He did not accomplish it as our substitute. So much for vicarious atonement! Now you assert that Christ’s obedience is irrelevant! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> Christ is the covenant Head and thus He earned for His elect that which He and His Father purposed, as already has been shown to you above in Hebrews… See if you can find the article, (1) The Adamic Administration, (2) The Atonement by John Murray on-line. You still do not understand biblical salvation.
Reformed and Always Reforming,
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Entire Thread
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The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Mon Sep 26, 2005 7:19 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Wes
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Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:21 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:48 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:00 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:52 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 7:32 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 8:49 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:25 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 4:49 AM
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Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 8:13 AM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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geomic1
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:58 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 4:41 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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William
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:29 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:02 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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William
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 1:21 AM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 2:24 AM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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Pilgrim
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 3:34 AM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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gotribe
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 1:22 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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MarieP
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 1:43 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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William
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:19 PM
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Romans 5
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MarieP
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:44 PM
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Re: Romans 5
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William
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 11:16 PM
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Re: Romans 5
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CovenantInBlood
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Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:34 AM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 11:12 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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William
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 11:23 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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geomic1
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 2:54 AM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 4:27 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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geomic1
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:48 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:39 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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geomic1
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 9:04 PM
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Re: Shooting Blanks
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J_Edwards
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:38 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 9:40 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:12 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:10 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:54 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Theo
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 4:43 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Sat Oct 01, 2005 2:04 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:21 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:19 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 12:11 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 12:27 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 3:58 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 9:51 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 10:53 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 11:55 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:10 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Wes
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:19 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:40 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:20 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:35 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:50 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:21 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 7:05 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 8:24 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 7:26 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 3:30 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 12:25 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:29 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:30 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Wes
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 1:57 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 3:56 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:35 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 1:25 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:22 PM
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Re: What about now?
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Paul_S
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:01 PM
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Re: What about now?
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Wes
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:43 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:17 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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jadeitedrake0
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:21 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Paul_S
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Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:56 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Tom
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Sun Oct 09, 2005 4:05 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Sun Oct 09, 2005 6:58 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Tom
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Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:23 PM
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Pink on this issue
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Tom
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Mon Oct 10, 2005 4:27 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Wes
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Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:18 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Isaiah
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Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:56 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:54 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:20 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Sat Oct 01, 2005 11:43 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Sat Oct 01, 2005 1:57 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:25 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:41 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:50 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:06 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Peter
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 6:58 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Tue Oct 04, 2005 2:34 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Thu Oct 06, 2005 11:00 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:46 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 2:35 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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geomic1
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 3:25 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 5:58 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Sat Oct 08, 2005 10:38 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:38 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Mon Oct 10, 2005 10:26 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:10 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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J_Edwards
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Fri Oct 07, 2005 9:06 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Sat Oct 08, 2005 12:50 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Sat Oct 08, 2005 11:04 AM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Pilgrim
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Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:25 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Anonymous
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Sun Oct 09, 2005 3:47 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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Tom
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Sun Oct 09, 2005 3:59 PM
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Re: The impeccability of Christ
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CovenantInBlood
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Sun Oct 09, 2005 1:16 AM
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