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#47173 Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:13 PM
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Pilgrim Offline OP
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"Why did God let Adam fall, and why did He create us all tainted with the same sin, when He might have kept Adam safe, and might have created us of other material, or of seed that had first been cleansed? God is He for Whose will no cause or ground may be laid down as its rule and standard; for nothing is on a level with it or above it, but it is itself the rule for all things. If any rule or standard, or cause or ground, existed for it, it could no longer be the will of God. What God wills is not right because He ought, or was bound, so to will; on the contrary, what takes place must be right, because He so wills it. Causes and grounds are laid down for the will of the creature, but not for the will of the Creator - unless you set another Creator over him!" - Martin Luther The Bondage of the Will, p. 209.


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simul iustus et peccator

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It was Luther's Bondage of the Will that sealed the deal for me....he was more Calvinist than Calvin.....and poor Erasmus...ouch, does he take a beating in this one....


The mercy of God is necessary not only when a person repents, but even to lead him to repent, Augustine

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Tom Offline
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If I understand Luther properly, I think it is safe to say that Lutherans don't represent Luther's beliefs.
I was once told by a Lutheran, that Calvinists don't understand Martin Luther properly, mainly because they don't understand the context of how Luther said things. The person referred me to a Lutheran confession that was written long after Luther died.
I personally think the evidence is against their understanding.

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Wed Aug 10, 2011 10:22 PM.
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Methinks that the following article will go a long way to show that Luther's view of predestination was just as much Calvinist as John Calvin's view, the view found in the Canons of Dordt, Westminster Confession, Savoy Declaration, etc.

Read this: Double or Nothing: Martin Luther’s Doctrine of Predestination


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Definitely read Bondage of the Will, Tom!

Luther may not be of the same mind in other Reformed points. But when it comes to predestination (and I would say election, soveriegn grace....the rest of TULIP) he is as Calvinist as they come.

Melancthon is the one who watered-down Lutheranism and made it free-will....

Last edited by AC.; Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:13 PM.

The mercy of God is necessary not only when a person repents, but even to lead him to repent, Augustine


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