The Highway Forums General Discussion Open Forum deacons and elders?

Recently I had a conversation with a dear friend of mine at church who was in the process of becoming a deacon. He was in the classes, etc and would soon be taking his exam. He told me he had not completely made the decision to take the office. When I asked why, he told me he had told the pastor that he felt unqualified, and that he thought as a deacon one should be more in the word and he wasn't sure he was ready to do that(I was a little confused as I thought we should ALL be in the word more). My pastor said, well if you don't FEEL qualified, then that is one sign that you probably are, and don't worry about the Word, that will come.<br><br>Now I know my knowledge of scripture is minimal, but does that sound right to you? The real truth several of the deacons have told him the same thing, and probably most are not in the Word, by their own admission. The elder that was involved in this situation at our church was completely taken back when I talked to him about Matthew 18 and the proper way to admonish someone. He literally said he didn't know what I was talking about, plus as I mentioned that our Book of Church Order had the same rules, I could not believe the look on his face. I am not certain he even knew we had that.<br><br>I am not trying to be ugly, but aren't the deacons and elders suppose to know something about he Word? The make is sound like the pastor is the teaching elder, and I suppose the other elders, are ruling(?) elders, yet I am at a loss as how one can RULE without knowing the rules?<br><br>Help my you guys who know. Is this common? As I was talking to another deacon in this other situation, he said, "there is something in Matthew 18 that says something about....." And what you can't hear in this is the confusion in his voice, and it was very obvious that this had just been repeated to him.<br><br>Thanks for your help. I am just curious if I have too high of expectations for the leaders of a community. And while I don't mean to sound cruel, my 17 year old daughter truly has more scriptural knowledge of practical Christianity than some of the leaders. The trouble being, I see no discipleship at all. <br><br>Linda

I cannot speak to the reaction of your Pastor or church officess. <br><br>I'm wondering. What type of preaching does your Pastor do? Is it topical or expository. From my perspective, churches that stress personal bible study and actually teach verse-by-verse through its preaching and classes are more likely to teach their congregation to have knowledge of the Bible. I'm not sure about those that teaches doctrine, and I am especially not sure about those that teach topically

Hello Linda,<br><br>I think your concerns are valid. To answer your question, yes, I believe that deacons need to be well acquainted with the Scriptures and the doctrinal standards of the church. Since subscription to the creed of the church is ordinarily required for deacons, there is no way in which they should do that without having a reasonably good grasp of the Scriptures, else they are merely assenting to the traditions of men apart from being persuaded that the subordinate documents accurately reflect the teaching of Scripture.<br><br>Besides this doctrinal issue, deacons are required to live exemplary lives before the congregation, for instance:<br><br>8 Likewise deacons must be reverent, not double-tongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for money,<br> 9 holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience. (1 Timothy 3:8 - 9)<br><br>It is impossible to hold to the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience if one does not have a reasonably good grasp of Scripture. The deacon should be a man "filled with the Holy Spirit and wisdom" (Acts 6:3), which will certainly not be true if he is ignorant of the Scriptures.<br><br>This is all the more true of elders, who not only serve in acts of love to the saints, but also rule and teach the congregation. For an elder to be ignorant of the steps of discipline as outlined in Matthew 18 is inexcusable and dreadfully dangerous. <br><br>In speaking to the matter of a man not feeling qualified as being an indication that he probably is, I have heard that same line used in our church. I appreciate what such men are trying to say because they are trying to root out those who believe they are sufficient in themselves for Christian service, but I'm not crazy about speaking in this manner. A man should have an internal persuassion that the Lord has gifted him to a particular task and that should be verified by the congregation affirming such gifts. If a man says that he does not feel qualified for a particular office, then perhaps he has a misunderstanding of the duties and qualifications for that office (which may very well disqualify him!) or perhaps he truly is not qualified because he knows his own heart better than we do. To be honest, I have found this response to be something of a politically correct one in order to avoid appearing as boastful. A man should be able to say, "By God's grace I believe that I am being called to serve in this capacity and I am seeking to have the church affirm or deny my gifts and qualifications." To me, THAT is an indication that he is probably qualified, not a false humility or a misconception of the nature of Christian service.<br><br>I hope that helps. Sincerely in Christ,<br><br>~Jason

Jason,<br><br>I appreciate the points you have made. I think the Lord will provide the necessary gifts to the leaders in His Church and each church should have some qualified individuals. It's important to recognize the qualities that are required of an office bearer. It's extremely important that the men who are considered for office are not novices but have been tested first in other opportunities to serve in the church. They should be put up for office based on their spiritual maturity and giftedness. It is not optional, they must be in the Word.<br><br>Unfortunately in many cases today men are put up for office because they are popular or have served in the past. But I think it should be limited to men who meet the Biblical requirements for office and have demonstrated leadership skills in the area they are being asked to serve.<br><br>In my opinion this is one of the serious problems in the church today. Lack of qualified leadership.<br><br><br>Wes

John<br>I appreciate all that you men have said, and I agree that God gives gifts where He gives a calling.<br><br>My pastor just started teaching through the book of Acts, but is not one to really enjoy much discourse about doctrinal things outside of the church service, or Sunday school class. He teaches very clearly the doctrines of grace, and yet I feel that his own feelings of inadequecies keep him from expecting much from his men. This past year there have been some challenges in my life and I realized recently that while he would pray for me, never once has he given me a scripture verse as comfort or instruction. I don't want to judge him at all, but it concerns me that he speaks more of community with one another, than true community with Christ. Does that make sense?<br><br>Linda