The Highway
Alberta sentence unvaccinated transplant patients to death.


https://www.jccf.ca/alberta-court-o...e-requirement-for-transplant-candidates/

Tom
So much for that Canadian Socialist "Universal Healthcare" where the government guarantees everyone good healthcare regardless of circumstances, eh? igiveup
Very true, unfortunately. My understanding also, is that this is in direct violation of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. However, in the last few years that is not unusual.

I have been hearing for quite some time now, many doctors afraid to operate on unvaccinated people.

Tom
There are more people who desperately need organs than there are organ donors. There are even less actual organs than there are donors, because not every donor dies in a manner that allows organs to be harvested, and not every organ is viable after harvest.
People die every day waiting for a transplant. Organs go to those that have the greatest need or the best chance of survival. Organs are not going to be WASTED on someone who is not willing to do everything in their power to reduce their risk of dying after transplant, and that includes refusing to reduce their chances of dying from a vaccine preventable infectious disease, not when there are others who desperately need those organs.

Requiring vaccines for transplants is nothing new, at least not in the US.

I would say this person sentenced herself to death.

https://health.ucsd.edu/news/releas...y-protected-by-covid-19-vaccination.aspx
ATulipNotADaisy

Wow!
I would not have expected to read people who have been deceived like you, on the Highway.
You said this woman sentenced herself to death.
I find that totally offensive coming from another believer.
Dr. Malone and many doctors risk losing their credentials for speaking up against government lies. Trudeau, Biden, Fauci, and the list goes on at the people that paint anyone who is against the vaccine as having unacceptable views.
You might not be aware of this, but the World Health Organization and the World Economic Forum are in cahoots and even one of the leaders of Pfizer, admitted under oath, that they did not know if the vaccine would work because they had to rush it.
You said:
Quote
Quite the opposite. BILLIONS OF PEOPLE (Let me say that word again, BILLIONS) have taken them. If they were not safe and effective we would know it by now.
The problem here is not that we do not know they are not safe. Rather, when problems occur it is either ignored; or something else is attributed to it.
The fact is, it is well known that a regular occurrence in those who are vaccinated against Covid, have “micro-clots”. I was talking to a relative about this who is retired from the medical field. He told me that it is true, but it is not true that these micro-clots cause health problems.
Studies however, say that this is not the case at all. I can’t remember exactly what this is called. However, apparently it has been proved that these vaccines, do not just go where they are supposed to, rather sometimes it leaks into places it is not supposed to and causes serious problems.
You will never hear about these kind of things reported in the liberal media, but it is not hard to find.
I also know of quite a few people, who within weeks of getting vaccinated, people fall to either death, or serious illness. Yet, the official physician report says it has nothing to do with the Covid vaccine.
Many doctors however, with impressive credentials have come forward to warn people about these things; yet when they do. They are called quacks, etc...
That is only part of the issue. Many things such as not being able to travel without a Covid-19 vaccine passport have been lifted; that is not universal. For example, I am not allowed to go into the USA or some other countries, because I am not vaccinated. I guess you are thinking “that is your own fault and you should not be able to travel”

I lost a friend a few months ago, when I was sitting in a coffee shop. He came in and sat with me and proceeded to tell me how stupid these people are that are flying Canadian flags on their pick-up trucks. They are doing this of course, protesting vaccine mandates that are ruining the country. Firing doctors, nurses, health care professionals, and truckers; simply because they refuse to get vaccinated. Also, many companies have decided to require a Covid-vaccine, in order to work for them. In other words, many were let go.
Normally, I just bite my tongue when people say things like this. However, that day I opened up and told him I was not vaccinated either. He hesitated for a moment and looked at me like I had a third eye.
I then told him, that my problem is not that so much people choosing to be vaccinated. It is forcing people to make a choice between choosing to obey these mandates, or suffer the consequences. This is completely against the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. (As an aside, I had one Christian say I am selfish for appealing to the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and we obey the government because we love our neighbor)
I then said how Trudeau and Dr. Bonnie Henry in B.C. Canada, are deliberately going against the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
He said, basically they should lose their job and that Trudeau and Dr. Bonnie Henry are doing a great job. Then he said that although it is too late now had he known that I was not vaccinated, he would not have sat with me. He made it quite clear, that he believes, like Bonnie Henry says, that the unvaccinated are dangerous to everybody else.
He then told me that he as a Christian to be honest is having a hard time forgiving people.

This of course is completely a lie and many who used to believe that lie; no longer do.
I will also mention Churches either complying with government Church mandates; or suffering the consequences.
In Alberta alone, I know about 4 pastors who had jail time because they believed (rightly I might add) that the Government had no business telling what the Church can either preach, or do.
Unfortunately, I have a relative that used to attend the Church of one of these pastors who spent over a month in jail. This person actually said that Church is a borderline cult.
I have actually watched a few videos of this pastor’s (Pastor James Coates) sermons and he was completely biblical. My own pastor said that if we are interested in hearing a good sermon on Romans 13, they should watch him.
I also watched an excellent series on Romans 13 by Dr. Samuel Waldron and it in keeping with what Pastor James Coates said.
However, this person I know said that they disagree and her own pastor is against that interpretation of Romans 13.
In the USA, I am not sure if pastors were jailed. However, I do know that many went to court over the issue. John MacArthur and Grace Community Church for example was taken to courts many times by Governor Newsom over their refusal to comply with government orders.
Something, I noticed and was talking to a good friend about. Is the fact that the preacher/theologians that we have grown to trust, over the years. Are the one’s that took a stand against the government lockdowns and organizations such as ‘The Gospel Coalition’, said the government was and is in their right to do what they are doing.
In fact, one prominent theologian in The Gospel Coalition, said John MacArthur by his stand, may have ruined over 50 years of ministry.
Now do not get me wrong, I do not always agree with John MacArthur; however he recognized the truth in this particular case.
Originally Posted by ATulipNotADaisy
There are more people who desperately need organs than there are organ donors. There are even less actual organs than there are donors, because not every donor dies in a manner that allows organs to be harvested, and not every organ is viable after harvest.
People die every day waiting for a transplant. Organs go to those that have the greatest need or the best chance of survival. Organs are not going to be WASTED on someone who is not willing to do everything in their power to reduce their risk of dying after transplant, and that includes refusing to reduce their chances of dying from a vaccine preventable infectious disease, not when there are others who desperately need those organs.

Requiring vaccines for transplants is nothing new, at least not in the US.

I would say this person sentenced herself to death.

https://health.ucsd.edu/news/releas...y-protected-by-covid-19-vaccination.aspx

I don’t necessarily blame you for taking things at face value in the very beginning. But your current attitude is not only alarming, it’s unChristian. This may be a blind spot for you. What about our God-given natural immunity?
The vaccine increases all-cause mortality. This is now confirmed beyond reasonable doubt.

Since those who do so either know or reasonably should know this, requiring it under any circumstances constitutes either attempted or actual murder.

Advocating for it is unlawful as well. The charge would be mitigated by the apparent fact that you have not bothered to do your research, and, therefore, are acting out of willful negligence rather than malice.
Tom,

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmo...b0UIEDLYjyDQI8av4iKT6IkOMnqGlrLZUGsgQKas

The people I see outraged about refusing organs to unvaccinated patients don't actually care about the patients or the transplant community. They are politicizing this story and stories like this for their own benefit. I always tell people that if they are passionate about advocating for transplant patients, we need people to sign up to be a donor, to promote organ donation and to decrease the stigma of transplant.

Anthony C,
Your God-given natural immunity is extremely suppressed by the anti-rejection drugs that a transplant recipient has to take for the rest of his life.

jta,
You are correct I have not done any research and neither have you. Unlike you, I have relied on people who actually do research for a living, not just scanning the internet looking for talking points that fit in with one's confirmation bias. Try googling these names:
Peter Hotez, MD, PhD
Paul Offit, MD
Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH-CIDRAP
Vincent Racaniello, PhD
These men have been around for years and working in the fields of vaccines, immunology, and epidemiology. They are not grifters who have come out of the woodwork during the pandemic.
ATulipNotADaisy

Quote
The people I see outraged about refusing organs to unvaccinated patients don't actually care about the patients or the transplant community. They are politicizing this story and stories like this for their own benefit. I always tell people that if they are passionate about advocating for transplant patients, we need people to sign up to be a donor, to promote organ donation and to decrease the stigma of transplant.

That is exactly what Trudeau wants us to believe. He has said that the beliefs of the unvaccinated are mostly extremists and went on to say they are mostly racists and misogynists.
https://tnc.news/2022/01/04/clip-re...ccinated-extremists-misogynists-racists/

He also questioned whether or not we should be putting up with the unvaccinated. In other words, he is thinking that he might need to go to more desperate measures.

Getting vaccinated does not improve ones chances of an organ transplant working!

Are you aware that under oath, one of the top people with Pfizer admitted that they released the vaccines before they knew they would work; because they needed to rush them?

This is exactly in keeping with doctors and scientists, were saying who disagreed with the vaccines being released. Yet, when they said these things, they were largely ignored, or considered quacks.

This is the same government that advocates for medical suicide for the homeless, depressed, and others. Which is now legal in Canada; which by the way is right in keeping with the WEF who believes the world is over populated and we need to reduce the population and deal with Climate change. I will not even get into Event 201, that happened shortly before the pandemic.

I do not trust anything he advocates anymore. I have however lost a so called "Christian friend" over my decision not to get vaccinated. He even believes that Trudeau and Dr. Bonnie Henry are doing a great job. Which unfortunately, I am finding a lot of Canadians agreeing with.

I am aware that, the court ruled that refusing an unvaccinated person to get an organ transplant. However, I am not the slightest bit surprised at the ruling. In Canada, for example Bill C-4 says that:
Quote
The view that says that there are only two genders, male and female, is a harmful myth.

I am tempted to address what you said to jta, but seeing it was not addressed to me; I will leave it to jta.

Tom
Originally Posted by ATulipNotADaisy
Tom,

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmo...b0UIEDLYjyDQI8av4iKT6IkOMnqGlrLZUGsgQKas

The people I see outraged about refusing organs to unvaccinated patients don't actually care about the patients or the transplant community. They are politicizing this story and stories like this for their own benefit. I always tell people that if they are passionate about advocating for transplant patients, we need people to sign up to be a donor, to promote organ donation and to decrease the stigma of transplant.

Anthony C,
Your God-given natural immunity is extremely suppressed by the anti-rejection drugs that a transplant recipient has to take for the rest of his life.

jta,
You are correct I have not done any research and neither have you. Unlike you, I have relied on people who actually do research for a living, not just scanning the internet looking for talking points that fit in with one's confirmation bias. Try googling these names:
Peter Hotez, MD, PhD
Paul Offit, MD
Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH-CIDRAP
Vincent Racaniello, PhD
These men have been around for years and working in the fields of vaccines, immunology, and epidemiology. They are not grifters who have come out of the woodwork during the pandemic.

That’s fair. This issue is not worth turning on each over. I do apologize for critical speech toward you.

If you are interested, here’s a lawyer who has been on the frontline of many legal battles. But I respect where you are coming from. I am very cynical so I come from a place of suspicion - that is not always a good thing. I drive my wife crazy, lol!
https://substack.com/profile/32334676-aaron-siri
I want to make myself very clear here. I am not against my brothers and sisters in Christ; who have chosen to get the Covid vaccine. What I am against, is it being made mandatory for people if they want to travel, work, and even do other things in everyday life.
I am presently not allowed to enter the U.S.A. because I am unvaccinated. .
Several people I know, have made some rather offensive comments towards me and those who have not been vaccinated, and believe it is my own fault for my choice on not obeying the government health guide-lines.
I chose to bite my tongue; rather than cause division between us, mainly because they are close relatives and friends. But make no mistake, those comments were hurtful; especially coming from them.

I am well aware that this is an issue that can be divisive and I do not want that. However, if Christians want to divide against those who because they after researching the matter; have decided they do not want to be vaccinated. That is where I draw the line!

In B.C. Canada, head doctor Bonnie Henry actually said that there will be no medical exemptions, or religious exemptions for not getting the Covid-19 vaccine. Recently, I heard however they have become a little more lenient on that; but reserve the right to change that without notice.

I know someone personally, that is allergic to several ingredients in the vaccine. so if she took it, it would probably kill her.

In Canada, there are Christians that believe PM Trudeau and health officials are doing the right thing. They treat anybody who has not been vaccinated as potentially dangerous to the rest of the population.

I can not respect someone (Christian or otherwise) who would say that a life saving operation should not be given for someone, that refuses to be vaccinated against Covid.

If someone does not like that; so be it.

Tom
Originally Posted by Tom
I want to make myself very clear here. I am not against my brothers and sisters in Christ; who have chosen to get the Covid vaccine. What I am against, is it being made mandatory for people if they want to travel, work, and even do other things in everyday life.
I am presently not allowed to enter the U.S.A. because I am unvaccinated. .
Several people I know, have made some rather offensive comments towards me and those who have not been vaccinated, and believe it is my own fault for my choice on not obeying the government health guide-lines.
I chose to bite my tongue; rather than cause division between us, mainly because they are close relatives and friends. But make no mistake, those comments were hurtful; especially coming from them.

I am well aware that this is an issue that can be divisive and I do not want that. However, if Christians want to divide against those who because they after researching the matter; have decided they do not want to be vaccinated. That is where I draw the line!

In B.C. Canada, head doctor Bonnie Henry actually said that there will be no medical exemptions, or religious exemptions for not getting the Covid-19 vaccine. Recently, I heard however they have become a little more lenient on that; but reserve the right to change that without notice.

I know someone personally, that is allergic to several ingredients in the vaccine. so if she took it, it would probably kill her.

In Canada, there are Christians that believe PM Trudeau and health officials are doing the right thing. They treat anybody who has not been vaccinated as potentially dangerous to the rest of the population.

I can not respect someone (Christian or otherwise) who would say that a life saving operation should not be given for someone, that refuses to be vaccinated against Covid.

If someone does not like that; so be it.

Tom
I’ve been on the wrong side of every politicized issue since I can remember. Don’t worry about the general consensus, even among Christians. If something doesn’t pass your smell test, trust your instincts and consult with a few that you trust.

In America, the lawsuits are abounding, but objective reporting is hard to come by. But in the meantime, you should find the link I previously posted on this thread helpful. ….
How many doses have been mandated at this point in Canada?
Anthony, as I indicated earlier, they have relaxed these mandates a bit for the time being as of around October. But many regulations are still in place.

I am not sure how many doses there are at this time; but I believe my elderly father in law has had 4 doses so far.

My elderly mom, like me has not been vaccinated, has paid for it in a number of ways. She has lost a few friends in her own building, who found out she was not vaccinated and they were not kind about it either. I think what hurt more for her though is in her own Church; how some of the ladies in her Bible study have gone against her stand. She usually is not too vocal about her stand; but this time she told them off and they are quiet about it now. I had told her, she needs to go the elders to tell them about this. However, she decided to handle it in her own way.

A friend of mine has not seen his mother for a few years now, except via livestream because she lives in a care home and he is not vaccinated.

If someone gets sick and is in hospital, whether it is a spouse or child. Unless you are vaccinated, you cannot visit them, unless they are at deaths door.

I can now travel anywhere in Canada and countries that allow the unvaccinated into their country.

The hospitals are dangerously low on staff, because all unvaccinated staff were let go and they according to the powers that be, will not be hired back.

They blame this all on the unvaccinated; but it is very clear even by many who are vaccinated that it makes absolutely no sense.
Yet, as I said many believe Trudeau and his cronies.

Tom
Anthony, thank you for the link. Some of the headings in it remind me of a video I saw, concerning one of the people in charge at Pfizer, admitting under oath, that they released the vaccine before they could test for safety and effectiveness; because it had to be rushed.

I mention this, because it is exactly what many doctors were saying about the vaccines. Yet despite this, the governments basically called them liars.

Tom
Originally Posted by Tom
Anthony, thank you for the link. Some of the headings in it remind me of a video I saw, concerning one of the people in charge at Pfizer, admitting under oath, that they released the vaccine before they could test for safety and effectiveness; because it had to be rushed.

I mention this, because it is exactly what many doctors were saying about the vaccines. Yet despite this, the governments basically called them liars.

Tom
The distinction here is this guy is a high profile lawyer who is using freedom of information laws and subsequent suits to obtain clinical and trial data that is being kept hidden from the public. They did have data, they just failed to release it and what they did release was partial, skewed or misrepresented. This guy is using legal avenues to expose these things. They are not debatable. It’s factual info. If you share the link and people don’t want to believe it, what else can you literally do?

I totally empathize with your frustration but you have all the facts already. There are no politicians that are going to bail us out and the media isn’t reporting anything.


Very few are eager to take the red pill- “used to refer to a process by which a person's perspective is dramatically transformed, introducing them to a new and typically disturbing understanding of the true nature of a particular situation.”

All I have to offer is understanding. Relief is getting much harder to come by…
Originally Posted by Tom
Anthony, as I indicated earlier, they have relaxed these mandates a bit for the time being as of around October. But many regulations are still in place.

I am not sure how many doses there are at this time; but I believe my elderly father in law has had 4 doses so far.

My elderly mom, like me has not been vaccinated, has paid for it in a number of ways. She has lost a few friends in her own building, who found out she was not vaccinated and they were not kind about it either. I think what hurt more for her though is in her own Church; how some of the ladies in her Bible study have gone against her stand. She usually is not too vocal about her stand; but this time she told them off and they are quiet about it now. I had told her, she needs to go the elders to tell them about this. However, she decided to handle it in her own way.

A friend of mine has not seen his mother for a few years now, except via livestream because she lives in a care home and he is not vaccinated.

If someone gets sick and is in hospital, whether it is a spouse or child. Unless you are vaccinated, you cannot visit them, unless they are at deaths door.

I can now travel anywhere in Canada and countries that allow the unvaccinated into their country.

The hospitals are dangerously low on staff, because all unvaccinated staff were let go and they according to the powers that be, will not be hired back.

They blame this all on the unvaccinated; but it is very clear even by many who are vaccinated that it makes absolutely no sense.
Yet, as I said many believe Trudeau and his cronies.

Tom
This is horrible! It’s tyranny. I’m sorry for what you are going through. We are also not out of the woods here in the States. Keep praying that we and our loved ones are spared from the worst of all this….

I guess we do have a few good reps left in the U.S. ….

https://gohmert.house.gov/news/documentquery.aspx?DocumentTypeID=1954&Page=1
Believe it or not, the leader of the PPC (People's Party of Canada) is reporting everything that has been happening and bluntly I might add.

Let me give you an e-mail to show something the PPC sent me recently.

Quote
Tom,

In Canada we have this bizarre pride in our healthcare system.

Canadians love to look down their noses at Americans and flaunt our access to “free” healthcare.

But the truth is our healthcare system is deeply dysfunctional and in desperate need of reform.

Unbelievable ER wait times, unreasonable surgery wait lists, shortages of nurses and doctors, unsustainably ballooning healthcare costs.

The list goes on and on.

But by far the most disturbing development has been the rise of Canada’s radical euthanasia program, or Medical Assistance in Dying (MAiD) as they call it.

When euthanasia was initially legalized in 2016, it was only available to terminally ill adult patients looking to die with dignity.

But in March 2021 the Trudeau Liberals amended the bill to expand its access to people with chronic pain and mental health issues.

Canada has quickly become a world leader in expanding this disturbing practice and making it easier to access, outpacing countries like Belgium and the Netherlands where it has been legal for 20 years.

In the last few months there have been viral stories of euthanasia being recommended to veterans coping with PTSD and to homeless people.

Last month, Quebec-based retailer, Simons, released, and then removed a disturbing ad campaign glorifying euthanasia, after I and others expressed outrage.

Tom, what is happening to our country?

What kind of society encourages vulnerable people to end their lives instead of protecting them? Especially our veterans who risked everything to keep us safe.

Do we have Healthcare or Deathcare in this country?

I’m scared for the future of our society. A society that values death over life is one trending to its own demise.

We need strong leaders in this country to stand up for pro-life values.

Thankyou,
Max
]

Also the following link looks like a Canadian equivalent of the link you provided.

https://www.jccf.ca/?mc_cid=fb33587857&mc_eid=0fcf070eeb

Tom
It is much worse than you and the PPC have described. The euthanasia policies in Canada have progressed to 'young adults' and minors are being considered not by just the government, but astoundingly by practicing pediatric physicians.

See here: https://cps.ca/documents/position/medical-assistance-in-dying
Pilgrim

Yes, I am aware of this; in fact my pastor touched on that issue; a few weeks ago in his sermon.
He mentioned a doctor who he talked to that actually told him; he has done medical assisted suicide and said it was the most beautiful thing he has done in his practice.

My pastor used that to launch into his message and it was very effective.

I forgot to mention; that I think it is great when a political party, goes against the flow that every other political party is going. The example I gave from the leader (Max Bernier) of the PPC, is just one example of what I have been receiving of late.

Taking a stand like that makes enemies; but it is actually quite refreshing to read.

Tom
Dr. Paul Offit was mentioned earlier in this thread. While top level scientists/FDA vaccine officials were compelled to resign over unethical practices. There is nothing typical about what’s transpired….


Quote
FDA Documents Confirm Top Scientists Were Frustrated Over CDC Ramming Through Boosters
Dylan HousmanOctober 26, 2022 1:58 PM ET
FDA Documents Confirm Top Scientists Quit Over CDC Ramming Through Boosters


Newly unearthed documents offer additional insight into the departure of multiple key vaccine officials from the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) last year.

Dr. Phil Krause, who resigned from his position as deputy director of the FDA’s vaccine review office last year, expressed frustration with the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) and Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) in emails obtained via a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request by Judicial Watch. Krause, along with director of the FDA’s vaccine review office, Dr. Marion Gruber, resigned due to reported disagreements with a push to authorize COVID-19 boosters for the general population.


“From my brief discussion with Peter [presumably, CBER Director Peter Marks] this morning, after some calls with CDC and HHS last night, the problem is that the [redacted]. Take a deep breath before reading this next paragraph,” Krause wrote in an unearthed email. “On that call, the CDC evidently stated that they will assemble all the data they are aware of on third dosing in this setting, and send it to us in the hope that we will (very soon) authorize the third dose for immunocompromised as part of the EUA.”

“Peter told me that CBER IOD [presumably CBER Immediate Office of the Director] will triage this—I told him I need to be cc:ed on any of these communications so we don’t get blindsided, but that we also need to protect the review team.” (RELATED: The FDA’s Own Experts Have No Idea Why It Approved Another COVID Booster Dose)

Last year, Krause co-authored an op-ed in The Washington Post criticizing the Biden administration for “sidelining” scientists in its rush to authorize and distribute booster vaccines. He then wrote in February that booster mandates weren’t justified, and would be “overkill at best” considering how many people already had natural immunity through prior infection.

More recently, FDA advisors have expressed frustration that the CDC and Biden administration are rapidly moving forward with booster authorization and recommendation. Dr. Paul Offit, an advisor on the FDA’s expert vaccine committee, told the Daily Caller he and his peers are at a loss for why the FDA is so determined to bypass normal procedures for the COVID-19 vaccines.

Dr. Krause did not respond to a request for comment by the time of this publication.
https://www.judicialwatch.org/fda-d...rated-over-cdc-ramming-through-boosters/
Anthony, thankyou.

That just confirms what one of the head people at Pfizer admitted under oath, about vaccines being rushed out too fast to assure their safety and effectiveness.

This is also something many doctors have been saying from the beginning. They paid for going against the flow.

Tom
“ When contacted by reporters, Drs. Anthony Fauci and Francis Collins of the NIH publicly and vociferously repudiated the “dangerous” declaration, smearing the scientists—all generally considered to be at the top of their fields—as “fringe epidemiologists…. emails obtained pursuant to a FOIA request later revealed that these attacks were not the products of an independent objective news-gathering process of the type that publications like the Times and the Guardian still like to advertise. Rather, they were the fruits of an aggressive attempt to shape the news by the same government officials whose policies the epidemiologists had criticized. Emails between Fauci and Collins revealed that the two officials had worked together and with media outlets as various as Wired and The Nation to orchestrate a “takedown” https://heidelblog.net/2022/12/scie...-speaking-out-on-broad-vaccine-mandates/

Quote
In Canada, columnists for the Toronto Star proclaimed, “Vaccine resisters are lazy and irresponsible—we need vaccine passports now to protect the rest of us” and “The unvaccinated cherish their freedom to harm others. How can we ever forgive them?” In the U.K., the Daily Mail contended, “It’s time to punish Britain’s 5 million vaccine refuseniks,” and Piers Morgan, a British presenter on TalkTV, suggested that unvaccinated people should not be allowed access to the country’s National Health Service.

Internationally, several politicians threatened to reimplement restrictions and told the public that “the unvaccinated” were at fault. Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said unvaccinated people “are very often misogynistic and racist,” and asked, “Do we tolerate these people?” President Joe Biden said that his “patience [was] wearing thin” and that we needed to “protect vaccinated workers from unvaccinated coworkers.” Michael Gunner, chief minister of the Northern Territory in Australia, stated that even if you are vaccinated, “if you are anti-mandate, you are absolutely anti-vax.” French President Emmanuel Macron declared that 5 million French people who remained unvaccinated were “not citizens.”

Across parts of the United States, Canada, Australia, and Europe, unvaccinated people were fired from their jobs, excluded from higher education, banned from many sectors of public life, denied organ transplants, and even punished by judges in probation hearings and child custody cases. Meanwhile, COVID cases continued to rise in many highly vaccinated countries with vaccine passports and other restrictions in place.

…. being misinformed about potential benefits and risks is an enormous deal for, say, a male college athlete who got vaccinated because he wanted to protect his elderly family members, but who then developed myocarditis. Telling him that this is fine because “there was so much unknown” is probably not much of a consolation, especially since his decision to get vaccinated was never going to protect his family members in the first place, and the vaccine manufacturers were given blanket immunity from liability.

It is one thing for the pharmaceutical companies, the Biden administration, the CDC, and the media to intentionally or unintentionally mislead the public; but it is another thing entirely for them to do this while government agencies actively coordinated to suppress alternative views or inconvenient data.
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/...evented-transmission-covid-alex-gutentag
I do not want pick on anyone in particular, but why do I get the feeling that many people who are reading this thread (maybe who have participated); would doubt this is true.

Tom
Originally Posted by Tom
I do not want pick on anyone in particular, but why do I get the feeling that many people who are reading this thread (maybe who have participated); would doubt this is true.

Tom
"Feelings" are hardly a reliable criteria to make a statement like that. You have no idea how many people read what is posted here, where they originate, what sources people use to form an informed decision or if many or any are even interested in such topics. Perhaps it is best to keep such "feelings" to yourself rather than risking being embarrassingly wrong. If nothing else, you also risk alienating someone who just might be trying to discern what the truth is, eh? wink
Originally Posted by Tom
I do not want pick on anyone in particular, but why do I get the feeling that many people who are reading this thread (maybe who have participated); would doubt this is true.

Tom
I’ve learned the hard lesson of being more selective in what I share and who I quote. It’s up to others to objectively discern and see through attempts to manufacture consent.
Quote
V-Safe Part 3: Who Were the 10 Million V-Safe Users Reporting a 7.7% Rate of Seeking Medical Care After Covid-19-Vaccine? Anti-vaxxers? Pro-vaxxers?
Third part of an incredible story that shows just how broken our public “health” apparatus is: very, very broken.


Who Registered for V-Safe?

After reading Parts 1 and 2, you know what data was captured by v-safe. Now let’s break down the people who likely registered for v-safe. Vaccine enthusiasts? Anti-vaxxers? Aliens?
https://aaronsiri.substack.com/p/v-...tm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2
More reasons unvaxxed transplant patients shouldn’t be denied. In fact, a non-Christian case could be made in the opposite direction. Personally, I wouldn’t make the case in either direction. …..

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House to repeal military COVID-19 vax mandate in defense bill

“ Congress is expected to repeal the Pentagon’s mandate requiring troops to receive the coronavirus vaccine in its annual defense policy bill set to be voted on by the House later this week, Fox News reported Tuesday.”
https://nypost.com/2022/12/06/house-to-repeal-military-covid-19-vax-mandate-in-defense-bill/

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Ron DeSantis Plans to Hold Pfizer and Moderna Accountable For Making False Claims About Their Shots

“We did a study in Florida and we saw an 86 percent increase in cardiac related activity in people ages 18 to 39 from mRNA shots and so we’re going to be doing some stuff to bring accountability there,” DeSantis told the RPOF Executive Committee members at the event. In the United States, the mRNA products are produced by Pfizer and Moderna.

Vaccines administered under an Emergency Use Authorization are protected from legal liability, but not if they were fraudulently produced. Brook Jackson, a whistleblower who worked for the Ventavia Research Group, the company that conducted Pfizer’s pivotal phase III trial in Texas in 2020, has filed a lawsuit in U.S. District Court accusing Pfizer of committing fraud, abuse, and protocol violations in its COVID Vaccine clinical trials.

For the past year, Equity Investment Executive and former Black Rock manager Ed Dowd has been compiling evidence from the insurance industry, funeral home industry, and government databases showing that excessive deaths among working-age Americans substantially increased in 2021 over 2020. In his new book, “Cause unknown,” Dowd demonstrates that non-COVID deaths among people aged 18 to 64 have exploded.

During a recent appearance on “Ask Dr. Drew,” Dowd argued that the employed population in the United States (98 to 100 million people) is experiencing about a 25 percent increase in disabilities compared to the general population.” https://amgreatness.com/2022/12/05/...r-making-false-claims-about-their-shots/
https://drdrew.com/2022/ed-dowd-ex-...-2021-with-dr-kelly-victory-ask-dr-drew/
Danish Health Authority….

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Why are people aged under 50 not to be re-vaccinated?
The purpose of the vaccination programme is to prevent severe illness, hospitalisation and death. Therefore, people at the highest risk of becoming severely ill will be offered booster vaccination. The purpose of vaccination is not to prevent infection with covid-19, and people aged under 50 are therefore currently not being offered booster vaccination.

People aged under 50 are generally not at particularly higher risk of becoming severely ill from covid-19. In addition, younger people aged under 50 are well protected against becoming severely ill from covid-19, as a very large number of them have already been vaccinated and have previously been infected with covid-19, and there is consequently good immunity among this part of the population.

It is important that the population also remembers the guidance on how to prevent the spread of infection, including staying at home in case of illness, frequent aeration or ventilation, social distancing, good coughing etiquette, hand hygiene and cleaning. https://www.sst.dk/en/English/Corona-eng/Vaccination-against-COVID-19

Any otherwise healthy transplant candidates under 50 in Denmark cannot be boosted… Why? Because COVID vaccines are no longer available to them….. Things may be looking up Tom!
This gentleman has lots of good guests….








Pilgrim

You are correct, the word "feeling" is not actually a good word to use. I am also finding out the hard way, that most of the time if I give any information of this nature; it is either completely ignored, or I am told not to share information like that ever again. They refuse to believe it at all.

This unfortunately is my own family; mainly because some of them are in the medical field and have completely bought into the vaccine narrative.
They are usually polite to me, but it is clear they believe I am in danger because I have not been vaccinated.

I hear them talking about these things, as though I am not in the room. Yet, if I mention what I believe it is clear my input is not welcomed.

To be honest it hurts; but I find it best just to pray in those situations.

So I hope you understand why I used the word "feeling".

I know from talking to friends and family members who agree with me; they are in the same boat. This includes my own mother; of which several women in her own Church out of supposed concern, were giving her a hard time about her not getting vaccinated. She finally because she got tired of it; told them to stop and fortunately they did.

However, her neighbor who she was really close to refuses to talk to her anymore.

Tom
And the sad part is that there are 100s of thousands, perhaps millions in Canada and the U.S. who have been duped by the lies of governments, CDC, and other medical agencies yet even when it is now public knowledge that vaccines do NOT prevent or even diminish infection or transmission nor do typical masks, even the N95 variety which actually harm individuals, these people continue to be ruled by the lies. But Tom, if you would stop for but a few seconds and look at several other 'narratives' which are likewise held tenaciously to be true but which are totally fabricated falsehoods; man-made "Climate Change", "Gender Identity and Transgenderism", the 'normalcy of "Homosexuality", et al. Anyone who questions the validity of these things are cancelled, ostracized, and even imprisoned in certain cases. What can I say?... welcome to a world which is under the power of the Evil One, which the One True God by His absolute sovereignty and providence is controlling according to His eternal determination for His glory and the elects sanctification. Perhaps I am not too far out of line in stating that I believe we in this time, which will become worse and worse as we move toward the great day of Christ's coming, are experiencing a wee view of what Hell is going to be like where depravity and sin are unfettered, albeit under the direction and will of God.

Advice? Same o, same o; avoid discussions of any of these current narratives with your family and alleged 'friends'. These false narratives are NOT the root cause of friction between you and them or the similar confrontations with anyone else. The root cause is the corruption of nature. It is the Gospel that they all need to hear and the Spirit's work of regeneration. Without that, all is futility and the truth will be rejected. THAT is YOUR main problem, i.e., do you REALLY believe this truth? Or, are you going to assume that these individuals are all regenerate and the problem is simply an intellectual one where they have chosen to believe a few falsehoods which if given the truth they will change their mind? scratchchin
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“man-made "Climate Change", "Gender Identity and Transgenderism", the 'normalcy of "Homosexuality", et al.”

Often a package deal of neopagan religious frevor. It’s clear why many would be susceptible to deception and seduction in these areas and across the board. Made easier if it’s the disposition of whole states and territories. This reality may not be any less heart breaking and challenging. But it needn’t be surprising. We don’t need to wait on any high profile expert or even theologian.
One last post then I’ll give it a rest….

Same “Dr” on 2 different programs. The presuppositions are different. One is establishment, ivory tower, ideological and the other is more frontline, patient centered and growing more skeptical. Science and healthcare should not be ideology-based. I do think public health sometimes wants to view society as one big mass of humanity. They would favor mandates, a one-size-fits-all approach (and maybe even sterilization, who knows). The other side is serious about informed consent and the oath to ‘do no harm.’




Pilgrim


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The root cause is the corruption of nature. It is the Gospel that they all need to hear and the Spirit's work of regeneration. Without that, all is futility and the truth will be rejected. THAT is YOUR main problem, i.e., do you REALLY believe this truth? Or, are you going to assume that these individuals are all regenerate and the problem is simply an intellectual one where they have chosen to believe a few falsehoods which if given the truth they will change their mind? scratchchin

As far as I can tell, these people are regenerate. I am finding that even in the Church I attend, there are those who are pro-vaccine and those who are against the vaccine. Which really is not the big issue with me. Rather, the mandates against the unvaccinated and the Church, is more the issue. I am glad this has been relaxed; though people like Trudeau are still talking like those who are not vaccinated are vermin.

Our pastor and elders asked that people would not let vaccines related issues, get in the way of unity in the body.

The few times that people gave their opinion during a Bible study group, the teaching elder asked them not to speak about it. I was quite thankful to an elder, on one occasion when someone at small group Bible study, started talking about how they were very disappointed in a lot of Christians for their obvious disobedience to Romans 13.
Before the elder spoke up, I had to stop myself from speaking my mind.

More than a year ago, my pastor spoke of an excellent sermon by an Edmonton Alberta pastor on Romans 13; this pastor (Pastor James Coates had been been jailed for his stand). It was clear my pastor wanted people to listen to that sermon. This spoke volumes as to my pastor's stand on the issue.

As an aside, concerning Edmonton pastor James Coates; unfortunately I have a family member that says that Churches stand, makes them a border line cult. Let me tell you, when they said that, I came very close to rebuking them.

I only wish my pastor would have preached on Romans 13 himself.

Concerning, homosexuality and other government agendas on occasion (as I previously told you) my pastor on occasion has told the congregation about these things.

Tom
I agree that mandates are the issue. If pro-vaccine Christians can at least understand that these shots are experimental, maybe they can come to a place of understanding with those who remain hesitant.
Originally Posted by Anthony C.
I agree that mandates are the issue. If pro-vaccine Christians can at least understand that these shots are experimental maybe they can come to a place of understanding with those who remain hesitant.

I wish they would believe that these shot are experimental. That is not the case, at least with pro-vaccine Christians I am around. They believe that those who say that these shots are experimental may be well meaning, but are believing lies.

In Canada, our health officials are still saying that the vaccines are perfectly safe and tested.
Thanks for the Dr. Drew videos; what I have heard so far is in keeping with others things I have read/heard. What really stands out to me, is the fact that most medical professionals who have concerns, about these vaccines get in trouble.

Tom
Originally Posted by Tom
Originally Posted by Anthony C.
I agree that mandates are the issue. If pro-vaccine Christians can at least understand that these shots are experimental maybe they can come to a place of understanding with those who remain hesitant.

I wish they would believe that these shot are experimental. That is not the case, at least with pro-vaccine Christians I am around. They believe that those who say that these shots are experimental may be well meaning, but are believing lies.

In Canada, our health officials are still saying that the vaccines are perfectly safe and tested.

Ok, forget the word experimental…..


Are these vaccines still considered EUA? Or have they been approved/licensed?
What is the benefit-risk assessment? Is it the same for all ages?
How many boosters are required? Does this cover every variant?

These assurances from health officials needn’t conflict with a request for further precise clarifications.

Unfortunately, according to the FDA,

“informed consent as generally required under FDA regulations is not required for administration or use of an EUA product”


If these vaccines are safe and effective they should be authorized/licensed ….. however, to do so would increase liability and an accurate account of potential short/long-term side effects that would potentially increase further hesitancy.

Tom, stop making excuses for these Christians. You don’t have to make them believe anything but they need to respect your informed opinion even if it comes in conflict with experts and officials. There are limits to your obedience to government. You don’t have to apologize or make excuses for ignorance. You may have to practice Christian attributes of patience and charity when expressing yourself but you don’t have to censor yourself. Or you can just leave it alone. But I would be prepared to respond accordingly if you are ever pressed in the future.


https://www.cmpa-acpm.ca/en/advice-publications/handbooks/consent-a-guide-for-canadian-physicians
Originally Posted by Tom
Thanks for the Dr. Drew videos; what I have heard so far is in keeping with others things I have read/heard. What really stands out to me, is the fact that most medical professionals who have concerns, about these vaccines get in trouble.

Tom
Yes, and being shamed and silenced is immoral, unethical and naturally fuels further skepticism and resistance.
I have not totally given up on trying to show the truth. However, I have grown tired of feeling I need to be the better person and biting my tongue and going to my knees instead of saying what I want to say.
I know beyond a reasonable doubt now, that should I push this issue; I lose the respect of family and friends.
As I said before, we have family and friends that are in the medical field. I was told that is who they get their medical information from, not me.

Is this an hill I am willing to die on? Is it a Gospel issue?

Tom
Originally Posted by Tom
As I said before, we have family and friends that are in the medical field. I was told that is who they get their medical information from, not me.

Is this an hill I am willing to die on? Is it a Gospel issue?

Tom

Then leave it alone…. But if you do, be at peace with your decision.

As far as it being a Gospel issue, I believe our brothers and sisters in Christ can have blind spots. But I also agree with Pilgrim that it can be indicative of a greater spiritual issue.
Originally Posted by Anthony C.
These assurances from health officials needn’t conflict with a request for further precise clarifications.

Unfortunately, according to the FDA,

“informed consent as generally required under FDA regulations is not required for administration or use of an EUA product”


If these vaccines are safe and effective they should be authorized/licensed ….. however, to do so would increase liability and an accurate account of potential short/long-term side effects that would potentially increase further hesitancy.

I also argue that to mandate a vaccine approved under EUA (emergency use authorization) is highly, highly unethical…

confusedBut I’m just one of the mindless, gullible peasants susceptible to ……


discernment ?
Agreed!
I must be one of the
Quote
mindless, gullible peasants susceptible to ……
as well.

We can use all the discernment we can get.

Tom
Originally Posted by Tom
Agreed!
I must be one of the
Quote
mindless, gullible peasants susceptible to ……
as well.

We can use all the discernment we can get.

Tom
Listening to this at the 1hr7min mark made me think of you….

Thank you, that is exactly what it seems like. To many of those who favour the vaccines, it is like a religious experience to them.

When the vaccines were rolled out the narrative said if you got the vaccine, you would not get Covid. When this proved untrue, it did not change many minds, they were still enamoured in their religious experience that they just chalked it up, to an error. But they could trust health officials to do the right thing to the population.

Evidence started coming out that the vaccines were having very little effect; however the health officials still ignored this. They kept this up and the general public for the most part is still drinking their kool-aide.

Tom
Yes, there are those who have the attitude that exudes: "Don't confuse me with the facts... I've got my mind all made up!". But there are many (dreaming on my part?) who have never heard the facts which are too often cancelled, removed, banned, etc. by Social Media or are never reported by the Drive-by Media". So, unfortunately they are seriously misinformed because they have not been exposed to the truth.
Pilgrim

Unfortunately when talking about something like this; we can miscommunicate, or overcommunicate (if I can put it that way).
A friend and I were actually talking about his experience that many people he knows who previously were completely taken in by the vaccine mandates; but say that they will not be getting anymore boosters.
I worded what I said above:
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To many of those who favour the vaccines, it is like a religious experience to them.


I emphasize the word
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many
not as though this is the case with ALL.

Rather because the section Anthony recommended in the link really seemed exactly what many in my life are doing.

Tom
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Freedom is not free. It requires fighting every day to push back against mandates.
Aaron SiriDec 22

Some of the successes resulting from this work are covered in the media, but many go silently into the night. No media. No public report. But they are not any less gratifying. These silent wins are often mandates, recommendations, licensures, authorizations, etc., that would have come to pass but didn’t…

There is nothing that has wrought more harm on humanity than the idea that individuals are too ignorant, uneducated, or unintelligent to make decisions for themselves. America was founded on the rejection of others dictating our lives (be they kings, dictators, etc.) and on the idea that we can all make individual decisions about our lives, including what risks we choose to take. The greatest risk is letting others make decisions on our behalf.

…In the last three years, the idea that we must eliminate our individual rights for what the government believes is best has taken hold. This is more dangerous than any virus. It is, ironically, what preceded this country and what has brought the worst harms ever wrought on humanity.

And there is no right more fundamental than the ability to reject an unwanted product being inserted, ingested, placed on, or injected into one’s body without threat or coercion.

…If you want a vaccine, great. If you want to take thousands a year, great. That is freedom. But please don’t try to coerce anyone else to take a medical product they do not want or consent to because you may one day find there is a mandated medical product you don’t want to inject, ingest, etc., into your body.

p.s. While striking down mandates and protecting exemptions are difficult, few appear to have believed that messaging against federal health authorities (that has all our taxpayer money) or pharma (that has a revolving purse of billions in profit every year) would be possible. But truth, pushed hard through the correct crack, has a way of multiplying and spreading. This occurred in the lawsuit against the FDA for Pfizer’s documents which resulted in global headlines such as “Wait what? FDA wants 55 years to process FOIA request over vaccine data.” That created a public cognition about the FDA and this product that would have otherwise taken billions of advertising dollars to accomplish. Here is wishing for truth to keep exploding through cracks and into the public consciousness in 2023!

https://aaronsiri.substack.com/p/fr...tm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2
Thanks Anthony

What you just said reminded me of a part of a really good book I am reading.

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The worldwide COVID-19 pandemic has been used as a pretext for worldwide globalization and an economic reset. As news about one coronavirus variant after another was announced, we were given various rationales for resetting the economic, geopolitical, environmental, and racial equilibrium of the world. There is a sense in which COVID-19 has proven that we are all one family in a connected global community.
In 2021, a couple reports were submitted to the World Health Organization (WHO), evaluating the worldwide response to COVID-19 and providing recommendations. In addition to government restrictions and mandates, the reports “supported the creation of an international pandemic treaty that would establish consequences if countries failed to live up to their commitments.”
Klaus Schwab, the man who founded the World Economic Forum, has written the book COVID-19: The Great Reset, which states in the introduction, “Since it made its entry on the world stage, COVID-19 has dramatically torn up the existing script of how to govern countries, live with others and take part in the global economy.”
When will things get back to normal? “The short response is never,” he writes. “We will continue to be surprised by both the rapidity and unexpected nature of these changes—as they conflate with each another…cascading effects and unforeseen outcomes.” We are assured that “no industry or business will be spared from the impact of these changes.”
Let’s take a closer look at where this will lead us.
The script calls for nations to no longer set policies that would be best for themselves, but best for the whole world. This means there will be huge transfers of wealth, particularly from the US to poorer countries in the interest of equity.
There is no hiding the agenda. On the World Economic Forum’s website, Schwab writes, “To achieve a better outcome, the world must act jointly and swiftly to revamp all aspects of our societies and economies, from education to social contracts and working conditions. Now is the time for the great reset. Every country, from the United States to China, must participate, and every industry, from oil and gas to tech, must be transformed. In short, we need a ‘Great Reset’ of capitalism.” The argument of Schwab’s World Economic Forum is based on the notion that control of goods and services must be transferred from individual countries to the global community in accordance with socialistic principles. As we noted in chapter 3, the World Economic Forum was asked their predictions for the world in 2030. One of the answers, already accepted by many, was, “You’ll own nothing. And you’ll be happy


Lutzer, E. W., & Charles, H. B., Jr. (2022). No reason to hide: standing for christ in a collapsing culture (pp. 236–237). Harvest House Publishers.
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In what might be the most unforgivable action to date, more than one thousand universities forced healthy college students to receive experimental vaccines for a disease that poses miniscule risk to young people. That went well beyond forced testing of students—what the cdc itself had already declared “illegal and unethical” in its now-removed post of October 13, 2020.* Then, in a frightening illustration of the unethical extensions of science denial, several top academic medical centers—Duke, Johns Hopkins, Stanford—ran a clinical trial injecting the financial sponsor’s covid vaccines into healthy infants and toddlers for an illness from which those subjects have miniscule risk for serious consequence. The researchers justified the drug’s success on indirect evidence of serum antibodies, rather than true clinical protection, because it prevented infection in only 37 to 51 percent, and because no subject, not even in the placebo group, had serious illness or death.

In Kafkaesque fashion, the America’s fda granted an emergency use authorization, or eua, on December 8, 2022, at a time when there is not a public health emergency from covid for children. Do most Americans realize that dating back to 2021, several other countries did not recommend, and some even forbade, covid vaccines in children without underlying illnesses—Finland, Norway, Denmark, Sweden, and others? Has the United States become a society that wants to use children as shields by injecting them with experimental drugs? It is not an overstatement to suggest that university scientists today have become this century’s Flat Earthers, but with an added dose of serious ethical and moral failure.

Finally, many elite American universities disqualified themselves on the most basic requirements of conduct for being trusted with our nation’s most precious assets—the minds of our younger generation. Professors engaged in censure, bullying, and character assassination to win arguments by comparing scientifically valid ideas, all of which have been proven correct, including targeted protection, to “eugenics” and the “Tuskegee syphilis experiments.” While this is not the first episode in American history to remind us of Joseph Welch’s famous lament “Have you no sense of decency?”, to many it illustrates today’s most disturbing deficit in our country—a lack of simple civility to others.

Nelson Mandela observed “There can be no keener revelation of a society’s soul than the way in which it treats its children.” America failed the test. From school closures to the reprehensible injection of experimental drugs into our own children as shields for adults, the heinous legacy of all who recommended and implemented those policies is serious physical and psychological damage to our children, especially the poor, the totality of which will not be known for decades. We urgently need to restore moral leadership of our nation’s institutions across the board, or the free and ethical society ideal of the United States has lost its legitimacy.
- Sins against children by Scott W. Atlas, The New Criterion https://newcriterion.com/blogs/dispatch/sins-against-children


* “It is unethical and illegal to test someone who does not want to be tested, including students whose parents or guardians do not want them to be tested,” the CDC said.” https://www.politico.com/news/2020/10/15/cdc-mandatory-school-testing-429667
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