<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]Well I would dstinguish female deacons from deaconesses. The latter is seeking to make a gender distinction, the former is not. I don't think it is fair to call it merely semantics. The arguments for and against do, of course, rely on biblical semantics (which is not mere semantics)! </font><hr></blockquote><p> This is a biblical distinction, not a gender distinction. The difference does not rely on biblical semantics, but biblical hermeneutics, which some attempt to make a matter of semantics encouraging a gender war. If what is taught in the pure Word of God is not worth defending and obeying then why do we even have a Bible? Far from being a semantical issue, the Scripture admonishes women to perform and function as God designed them to. Women are not in any way inferior to men in Pauline thought. Even Macarthur, who allows woman deacons at Grace Community, states, <br><br><blockquote>[color:blue]A woman’s subordinate role did not result after the Fall as a cultural, chauvinistic corruption of God’s perfect design; rather, God established her role as part of His original creation (1 Tim 2:13). God made woman after man to be his suitable helper (Gen. 2:18; 1 Cor. 11:8-9). The Fall actually corroborates God’s divine plan of creation (Gen. 3:1–7). By nature Eve was not suited to assume the position of ultimate responsibility. By leaving Adam’s protection and usurping his headship, she was vulnerable and fell, thus confirming how important it was for her to stay under the protection and leadership of her husband (2 Tim. 3:6 -7). Adam then violated his leadership role, followed Eve in her sin, and plunged the human race into sinfulness—all connected with violating God’s planned roles for the sexes. Ultimately, the responsibility for the Fall still rests with Adam, since he chose to disobey God apart from being deceived (Rom. 5:12–21; 1 Cor. 15:21-22 ). </blockquote></font color=blue> It appears that from the PCA and others distinctive use of the term “deaconess” they desire the woman to go from picking the forbidden fruit to having the title of
Forbidden Fruit Picker. Why is it that women need a "title" to serve God with? IMHO most have demonstrated through the ages that they don't. But in this age this appears to be part and parcel of the issue--I want a title, when they do not even meet the biblical qualifications for such (1 Tim 3:12)! This reminds me of,<br><br><blockquote>[color:blue] "Does your mother pick up trash for a living?" "Oh, she is much more important than that, she is a sanitation engineer!"</blockquote></font color=blue> What about the authority issue between men and woman? Who is suppose to biblically rule who? Whether ordained or not ordained if they [color:red]
control an office and they control men under their "authority”</font color=red>, is this not a violation of Scripture? <br><br><blockquote>[color:blue]Hebrews 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you. <br><br>1 Timothy 2:11-12 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. </blockquote></font color=blue> In these days of “Women’s Lib” and other feminist movements, the word [color:red]
submission</font color=red> makes some people see red. Some unbiblical writers have even accused Paul of being a “crusty old bachelor” who was anti-women. Those of us who hold to the inspiration and authority of the Word of God know that Paul’s teachings came from God and not from himself. If we have a problem with what the Bible says about women in the church, the issue is not with Paul (or Peter— Peter 3:1–7), but with the Lord who gave the Word (2 Tim. 3:16–17). <br><br>The word translated [color:red]
subjection</font color=red> in 1 Tim 2:11 is translated [color:blue]
submitting</font color=blue> and [color:blue]
submit</font color=blue> in Eph 5:21–22 and Col 3:18 . It literally means [color:red]
to rank under</font color=red>. Anyone who has served in the armed forces knows that [color:red]
rank</font color=red> has to do with order and authority,
not with value or ability. A colonel is higher in rank than a private, but that does not necessarily mean that the colonel is a better man than the private. It only means that the colonel has a higher rank and, therefore, more authority. <br><br>[color:blue]
Let all things be done decently and in order</font color=blue> (1 Cor. 14:40) is a principle God follows in His creation. Just as an army would be in confusion if there were no levels of authority, so society would be in chaos without submission. Children should submit to their parents because God has given parents the authority to train their children and discipline them in love. Employees should submit to employers and obey them (Eph. 6:5–8 , where the immediate reference is to household slaves, but the application can be made to workers today). Citizens should submit to government authorities, even if the authorities are not Christians (Rom. 13; 1 Pet 2:13–20). <br><br>Submission is not subjugation. Submission is recognizing God’s order in the home and the church, and joyfully obeying it. When a Christian wife joyfully submits to the Lord and to her own husband, it should bring out the best in her. (For this to happen, the husband must love his wife and use God’s order as a tool to build with, not a weapon to fight with— Eph. 5:18–33). Submission is the key to spiritual growth and ministry: husbands should be submitted to the Lord, Christians should submit to each other (Eph. 5:21), and wives should be submitted to the Lord and to their husbands. <br><br>The emphasis in this section (1 Tim. 2:9–15) is on the place of women in the local church. Paul admonished these believing women to give evidence of their submission in several ways (I will skip over some and get to the point at hand). Teaching and exercising authority (2:11–15). Women are part of the worshiping community and have every right to learn (v. 11). Yet this right must not be used to set aside the differing roles of men and women in the church and home. So Paul immediately adds the words
in quietness and full submission. Submission is the concept Paul uses in describing the role relationship of a woman to her husband (Eph. 5:22–24; Col. 3:18; Titus 2:5; 1 Pet. 3:1, 5- 6). Quietness is to be understood in terms of that which is not permitted, namely, to teach (v. 12), which is underscored by saying again that a woman must be silent.<br><br>Paul does not permit women to do two things in the church:
to teach or to have authority over men. Paul does not forbid women to teach other women (Titus 2:4–5) or children (2 Tim. 1:5; 3:14–15). A woman must not teach
a man. Here public teaching is in view, not personal activity (such as Priscilla and Aquila assisting Apollos [Acts 18:26]; an exception IMHO rather than the rule). Paul also does not permit a woman to have authority over a man. She must not exercise leadership or rule over men who are appointed by God to have that headship function in the church and home (1 Cor. 11:3, 8-9; Eph. 5:23).<br><br>The reason for Paul’s restrictions is the very order of creation of man and woman by God—namely, man first, and then woman from man. 1 Cor 11:8–9 contains Paul’s fullest statement of the theological significance of this order: “For man did not come from woman, but woman from man: neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.” Blending 1 Cor 11 and Gen 2 one may say that woman, equally the image of God, was created to help man and to follow his leadership, just as Christ recognizes the headship of God the Father (1 Cor. 11:3).<br><br>Paul cites the fall, where the roles were reversed, as the negative illustration of this principle. Adam definitely chose to follow his wife’s leadership in their act of disobedience (God’s rebuke in Gen. 3:17) “It was the woman who was deceived” echoes Eve’s own verdict as to what happened when she exercised authority and took the position of leadership (Gen. 3:13). The simple words that she “became a sinner” (better, “fell into transgression”) indicate the dire consequence of such a role reversal.<br><br>What does it mean for a woman [color:red]
to usurp authority over the man</font color=red>? The word "authority" here is found only this one time in the NT and because of this has been the subject of misunderstanding. The generally accepted understanding of [color:red]
authenteo</font color=red> reveals that the idea is that women are not to exercise authority over men. The connective "or" (oude) seems to indicate that teach is being defined by the term “have authority.” Some have wrongly thought that the two terms should be joined and translated “to teach in a domineering manner.” Thus, if women teach with a proper attitude, they may (it is said) teach men in the congregation. This introduces a grammatical idea simply not found in this text and one not characteristic of the apostle’s writing style. Certainly Paul would not want anyone—men or women—to teach improperly. Moreover, the text nowhere indicates that the apostle is prohibiting the teaching of false doctrine (which would be prohibited for men and women alike). Rather the apostle is prohibiting any teaching of men by women (congregational teaching is obvious in the context, vv. 8–12) or of women being in congregational authority over men. Paul, then, does not disallow the teaching by women because of cultural reasons or the aptitude or education of women. The exhortation relates to theology alone, to the creation order and the fall. It seems best to understand this passage as teaching that women may exercise any of the spiritual gifts they have received and developed in a variety of ministries in a local assembly (2 Tim. 3:14, Titus 2:3-4), other than teaching men, when done under appropriate male (elder) leadership. Women may serve the body of Christ in many types of ministries, but men function as God’s official leadership in the local assembly. Thank God for women!
