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thredj #26632 Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:42 AM
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The answer is none, if I don't have the whole Word of God why would I want to use something limited such as those books you listed. When I evangelize thredj I mainly use Romans but I also use parts of Isaiah, Exodus, ect... I don't use the gospels although I usually disciple someone with John first. So I guess I'm beyond your poll.

PS CHICK TRACTS??!?!?!?! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/puke.gif" alt="" />


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #26633 Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:41 PM
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PS CHICK TRACTS??!?!?!?!

<img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Obviously you didn't notice the sarcasm...eight chick tracks-one an hour. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

You're not beyond the poll, I don't think anyway. Hopefully everyone realizes that these aren't the ONLY options I see available. Again, out of the choices what would you use? Surely those of you who say the choices aren't sufficient aren't saying that if you only had one one of them you couldn't effectively communicate the gospel...surely that's not the case.


tj
"-that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection..."
thredj #26634 Tue Jul 19, 2005 3:21 PM
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All of Scripture would of course be brilliant!

Although... from personal experience with my unbelieving friends, starting with a broad overview sometimes causes them to throw in an endless supply of red herrings! I read up about Ray Comfort (anyone know of him?), and liked his analogy of aiming the bullet at the heart. The "bullet" being God's moral law - the Ten Commandments.

After endless debate with my one Catholic friend (him going off about having to interpret Revelation and so on..) - I presented him with the following, which, as Scripture puts it penetrated him, dividing soul and spirit and judging the thoughts and attitudes of his heart. For the first time, he was speechless. Please pray for him - his name is Kevin.

I think it was also Ray Comfort who said that using the Ten Commandments as a starting block is great because all of humanity can relate to it - not just specific religions. What do you think?

Sincerely in Him,
Dave


[color:"blue"]
~ The worth & excellence of a man is measured by the object of his love. That is why we make God the object of our love! ~
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David_P #26635 Tue Jul 19, 2005 4:40 PM
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Here are a couple of articles which I am sure you will find helpful in regard to the law and the Gospel:

1) The Law Established by the Gospel, by John Colquhoun

2) The Law and the Gospel, by John Colquhoun

And, just one comment about the presentation you linked to here: Are you Good?. I was immediately put off from the very first question, "Are you good enough to go to heaven?". I believe it is fallacious to hold out "heaven" as a carrot in order to lure people into a discussion about God. Man's immediate need is not a future heaven, but rather reconciliation with God here and now. Men need a new nature; a radical change of their very core being, forgiveness of sins and the ability to overcome sin. Secondly, heaven is not man's end. Heaven is a "way station" where the souls of the saints reside until the consummation and their ultimate glorification. We look forward to a New Earth whereupon the children of God shall live for eternity in the presence of God.

I believe if one is to use a "packaged" presentation, something like John Blanchard's, Ultimate Questions is far better. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

In His Grace,


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simul iustus et peccator

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thredj #26636 Wed Jul 20, 2005 1:08 AM
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thredj said:
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PS CHICK TRACTS??!?!?!?!

<img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Obviously you didn't notice the sarcasm...eight chick tracks-one an hour. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

You're not beyond the poll, I don't think anyway. Hopefully everyone realizes that these aren't the ONLY options I see available. Again, out of the choices what would you use? Surely those of you who say the choices aren't sufficient aren't saying that if you only had one one of them you couldn't effectively communicate the gospel...surely that's not the case.

Okay tj I'll take your silly little poll just so I can see how it turns out. But I stand by my answer I use the whole book or nothing.

And to misquote Steve Martin in Roxanne "Oh, ho, ho, sarcasm! Oh, no, no, we don't get that here. See, uh, people ski topless here while smoking dope, so sarcasm's not really a high priority. We haven't had any sarcasm here since about, uh, '83, when I was the only practitioner of it. And I stopped because I was getting tired of being stared at."

Thank you and good night. Remember folks the seven o'clock show is nothing like the ten o'clock show.


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #26637 Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:48 AM
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Boan,

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And I stopped [being sarcastic] because I was getting tired of being stared at

We suffer from the same disease only I never stopped. So what if they don't have the faintest idea of what your talking about? I just go ahead and then walk away knowing that only the good Angels, "get it".

We're from the same state and not only do they dope up and ski topless, but then they get completely undressed and jump into hot tubs with 50 dollar bottles of chardonnay.

Enlightened minds, such as these, will never "get it".

Denny

Roms 3:22-24


Denny

Simon Peter answered Him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life." [John 6:68]
Pilgrim #26638 Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:29 PM
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Ultimate Questions is EXCELLENT! I've given it to all my friends. John Blanchard is actually an excellent evangelist. He came to South Africa in Feb - he preaches really well.

My Dad has been telling me recently to avoid the rut of "evangelism-in-a-can" type approach - so starting off with presenting my friends with the Law has been really great. It has certainly given our discussions more direction!

Pilgrim, I agree completely will all you said. I agree with it from our perspective though. From an unbeliever's perspective, they don't care in the least what their relationship with God is. They don't care about anything like that, at least until the Holy Spirit works within them! My friends have scoffed at me when I tell them they need "a new nature; a radical change of their very core being, forgiveness of sins and the ability to overcome sin," because they already think they are "good people".

Maybe the flash presentation should have started with "Are you saved? If you die tonight, will you go to Heaven?". But nevertheless, it seems to be a nice and simple online tract to share with people.

Yours in Him,
Dave


[color:"blue"]
~ The worth & excellence of a man is measured by the object of his love. That is why we make God the object of our love! ~
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David_P #26639 Wed Jul 20, 2005 5:18 PM
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David_P said:
Pilgrim, I agree completely will all you said. I agree with it from our perspective though. From an unbeliever's perspective, they don't care in the least what their relationship with God is. They don't care about anything like that, at least until the Holy Spirit works within them! My friends have scoffed at me when I tell them they need "a new nature; a radical change of their very core being, forgiveness of sins and the ability to overcome sin," because they already think they are "good people".
And how else would you expect an unbeliever to react to the truth; particularly in regard to their depraved nature and the fact that they are guilty before God? If the saying, "The truth hurts!" was ever applicable, it is here. But although unbelievers naturally hate the truth. (Jh 3:3-6, 19; 8:43; 10:26; Acts 7; Rom 8:5-8; 1Cor 2:14) Yet, it was the design of God to call the elect through the truth of the Gospel. (Rom 1:16; 1Cor 1:18, 21, 23; Rom 10:14-17) It is impossible to make the Gospel more palatable to an unregenerate man. Yet, this is exactly what the majority are trying to do today, but fail miserably. What they are doing is offering an admixture of the "gospel" and the "world"... sorta like adding a bit of sugar to sweeten something which is too sour; at least so they think. But to do so is dishonoring to God and a perversion of the truth and which most often produces results which do not accomplish the original intent; to see men saved.

Here is an incredible article by J.I. Packer which I am sure will find most enlightening and helpful: The Old Gospel and the New.

In His Grace,


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simul iustus et peccator

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Pilgrim #26640 Wed Jul 20, 2005 6:00 PM
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I couldn't agree more!!

I didn't quite express myself fully. Due to the arbitrary nature of all my discussions with my friends, I've been struggling to find a good "starting block". In my discussions, if I don't show them the exceeding sinfulness within them, and the seriousness of it BEFORE telling them about the need to be saved -- THEN they scoff - because they just don't see a problem. My evangelism is still weak <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Don't get me wrong... I'm not giving them that "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life" nonsense. On the contrary, I'm aiming the bullet at the heart! And its most certainly not going down too well with them.

Thanks for the link! I'll read it tomorrow. Time for bed!

Yours in Him,
Dave


[color:"blue"]
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Peter #26641 Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:52 AM
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Okay tj I'll take your silly little poll just so I can see how it turns out. But I stand by my answer I use the whole book or nothing.

And to misquote Steve Martin in Roxanne "Oh, ho, ho, sarcasm! Oh, no, no, we don't get that here. See, uh, people ski topless here while smoking dope, so sarcasm's not really a high priority. We haven't had any sarcasm here since about, uh, '83, when I was the only practitioner of it. And I stopped because I was getting tired of being stared at."

Thank you and good night. Remember folks the seven o'clock show is nothing like the ten o'clock show.


Don't forget to tip your waiters and waitresses. <insert Tonight Show theme>


tj
"-that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection..."
thredj #26642 Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:04 PM
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I would tend to use Matthew, it provides a good historical basis and a fine synopsis of the life and teachings of Jesus the Christ.


Grace is not common.
thredj #26643 Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:16 PM
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I chose the answer about using one of the gospels. I would use Mark because it is shorter than the others and would afford the opportunity to share all of Christ with the individual and still probably have time to discuss what was read if need be.

thredj #26644 Thu Aug 25, 2005 11:22 PM
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I wouldn't use any of the above options but instead give the unbeliever a copy of Joel Osteen's book Your Best Life Now.

Wes #26645 Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 PM
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<img src="/forum/images/graemlins/BigThumbUp.gif" alt="" /> I was thinking along the same line as you but noticed that others didn't like that approach.
In my case, I find if I focus on one book such as John, I am less likely to go on bunny trails, especially with the fact that John covers so much in his book.


Tom

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