You know this question was posted on another discussion board I flit through now and then and it broke down to basically those two view points. Although I must say Pilgrim that it was the Baptist that said no and the Presbyterian that said yes in the forum. Maybe I'm rubbing off on you <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />

Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo