There is a difference between being in a cult and doing cult like acts. So just because they are not defined as a cult does not mean that their redefining of words is not divisive to unity and disruptive to the Body. So it has bearing on this discussion.
you ask: Mike, consider the following verses, and for a moment, just consider the possibility that the word “salvation” does not always and only refer to the moment of conversion:
Hebrews 9:28: So Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.
Romans 13:11: And do this, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep; for now our salvation is nearer than when we first believed.
1 Peter 1:3-5: 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Given these verses, is it not true that there is a sense in which salvation is still awaiting us and that only those who persevere to the end faithfully will be saved?
me. Yes it is true. But that is a far cry then saying someone is saved but goes to hell. We are saved now, we are being saved, and we will be saved completely when we see Him face to face. But in each stage of 'being saved' we draw closer to what we will be. Therefore in the first 'save' at conversion the last 'save' at resurrection is a truth we can look forward to.
And while there are those who THINK themselves saved but are not so they do not and can not persevere, it is not as if they were saved in the first place. Since it is God who looks at the hearts of men and we who only see the outward side, we as fallible men might think a person saved who is not. We baptize them and participate with them in the Supper, and give them the right hand of fellowship. But it is God who saves and when He does it, it is a permanent salvation.
you. Thank you for that reminder. My point was simply to demonstrate how a refusal to think outside one’s own system of thought will result in an inability to accurately assess internal coherency in somebody else’s paradigm because he’ll keep reading back his own terms into it.
me. Jason, I am not trying to address their internal coherency of the paradigm they preach. I am addressing the divisiveness and disruption of unity they propagate by their false teachings. To say that one who is saved and elect may go to hell is against what the Bible teaches, and hence wrong. Because they redefine terms to redefine doctrine, they distort what the Bible says, unless one thinks that the dcotrine taught now is incorrect and not biblical.
