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Hi Pilgrim, In reply to: [color:"blue"]...it was said by Wilson (sorry, can't immediately provide the quote), that the Church has erred for centuries, even the Reformation erred, in understanding the doctrine of justification and it is the goal of the "Auburnites" to "bring the Church back to the true biblical teachings
I truly find that surprising and would have to see the quote to believe it. If you come across the quote please send it to me.
In reply to: [color:"blue"] Advocates of the "Auburn Avenue Statement" and particularly of the teachings of Norman Shepherd are bold to say that one is justified by faith, but justification must be secured by "keeping covenant", else you be found a covenant breaker and be cut off. This is what paragraph 12 is teaching, without any doubt.
If Justification is secured through our covenant faithfulness or if that faithfulness in any way contributes to ones Justification as we and our confessions ordinarily use the term, then that is indeed heresy. My difference with you would certainly not be there, rather with whether or not such is being taught by Auburn Ave. Simply put, no where does the Auburn statement maintain that the “persons, not destined for final salvation, [who are] drawn to Christ and His people only for a time” are justified. Hence, it is not forensic justification from the decretal (or metaphysical) perspective that is “secured” through covenant faithfulness. But it’s not my wish to get into a debate as to what they are and are not saying as I don’t think that would be a profitable discussion. Suffice to say we agree on what would constitute a heresy here, but disagree on whether or not it is being said.
Sincerely in Christ,
~Jason
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Entire Thread
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Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Mon Jul 07, 2003 11:02 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Wes
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Mon Jul 07, 2003 11:15 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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MarieP
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Tue Jul 08, 2003 9:20 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Wed Jul 09, 2003 11:01 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Wed Jul 09, 2003 6:41 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Wed Jul 09, 2003 7:29 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Thu Jul 10, 2003 2:14 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:06 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Thu Jul 10, 2003 9:01 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 12:04 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 12:26 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 1:44 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 2:40 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 1:37 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 3:11 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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carlos
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 9:18 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:28 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 1:23 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 2:43 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 5:10 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 10:11 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 10:59 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 11:25 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 12:13 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 12:30 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 12:41 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 5:26 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 2:11 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 7:41 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 8:35 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Wed Jul 16, 2003 12:28 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Wed Jul 16, 2003 10:01 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Fri Jul 18, 2003 7:01 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Fri Jul 18, 2003 10:00 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 9:17 PM
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more on Schlissel
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carlos
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Sat Jul 19, 2003 12:32 AM
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Re: more on Schlissel
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Jason1646
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Sat Jul 19, 2003 1:10 AM
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Re: more on Schlissel
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carlos
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 2:13 AM
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Re: more on Schlissel
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Jason1646
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 3:31 PM
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Re: more on Schlissel
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Pilgrim
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 8:29 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 10:49 PM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Pilgrim
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 12:49 PM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Jason1646
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 4:02 PM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Anonymous
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 9:35 PM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Pilgrim
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 9:49 PM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Anonymous
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Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:44 AM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Pilgrim
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Mon Jul 21, 2003 1:25 AM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Anonymous
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Mon Jul 21, 2003 1:52 AM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Pilgrim
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Mon Jul 21, 2003 2:44 AM
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Re: Shepherd's teaching online
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Anonymous
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Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:21 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 11:30 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 4:18 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Thu Jul 17, 2003 3:29 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Jason1646
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Thu Jul 17, 2003 12:29 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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gotribe
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 9:51 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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RefDoc
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 11:33 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Sun Jul 13, 2003 12:08 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Sun Jul 20, 2003 3:05 AM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Anonymous
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 2:15 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Wes
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Wed Jul 09, 2003 8:29 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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timmopussycat
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Wed Jul 09, 2003 10:56 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Pilgrim
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Thu Jul 10, 2003 1:19 AM
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Would Edwards Call it Heresy?
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J_Edwards
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Thu Jul 10, 2003 9:53 PM
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Re: Marks of Heresy
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Theo
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Wed Jul 09, 2003 1:07 AM
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