The Highway Forums General Discussion Theology Discussion Forum New heavens and new earth

Again, I'm really puzzled because the CONTEXT begins in verse 17 with "For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth:", which certainly is referring to the eternal state, e.g.,

2 Peter 3:10-13 (ASV) "But the day of the Lord will come as a thief; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall be dissolved with fervent heat, and the earth and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Seeing that these things are thus all to be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in [all] holy living and godliness, looking for and earnestly desiring the coming of the day of God, by reason of which the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? But, according to his promise, we look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness."

It seems quite clear, at least to me that this NT passage, which takes precedence over an OT passage which is less clear to boot, is that the present creation is going to be cleansed by fire from which process a new heaven and earth will emerge purified. And one more:

Revelation 21:1-5 (ASV) "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth are passed away; and the sea is no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven of God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true."

Here again, we have the "new heaven and a new earth" which is the new creation, the telos of God's redemptive plan for the ages, aka: the eternal state.

So, either you take verse 17 'literally' along with the rest of the passage up to Isa 20 (no pick & choose allowed), which means it is a description of the eternal state. OR, you redefine the phrase "new heaven and a new earth" to mean something entirely different and temporal compared to all the other passages which clearly speak of them as the final eschaton. I opt for the former and take it literally as referring to the eternal state and see the rest of the passage, including v. 20 as a contrast to what was the current situation of Isaiah's day, i.e., death predominated both children and adults and long life was but a fading dream.

"Posties" take this passage in a similar manner as the Dispensationalists because they too are looking for some alleged "Golden Age", a literal Millennium on earth. Obviously, I disagree.