The Highway Forums General Discussion Theology Discussion Forum 'Water and the Spirit'

Thanks for your replies, everyone.
I think that Wes has got it right. The text is very clear; without this two-fold birth, no one will enter the Kingdom. Therefore if the 'water' refers to baptism, then the thief on the cross, and the whole bodies of Quakers and the Salvation Army (who do not practise water baptism) are lost without exception. Also, as Wes said, our Lord chides Nicodemus for not knowing what He (Jesus) is talking about (v10). This would be unfair if the reference is to baptism because there is no OT index that Nicodemus could have picked up to help him understand.

So whatever the 'water' is, there must be an OT reference to it. What the Lord Jesus is saying is that the New Birth is a two-fold operation by the Holy Spirit (V6): the washing away of sins and Spiritual renewal.

Ezek 36:25ff. 'Then I will sprinkle clean water on you and you shall be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols......
[obviously no outward washing can cleanse from these inward impurities]
......I will give you a new heart and put a new sprit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes and keep them, and you will keep My judgements and do them.'

Psalm 51:7ff. 'Purge (NIV 'wash') me with hyssop and I shall be clean; wash me and I shall be whiter than snow.......create in me a clean heart, O my God, and renew a steadfast spirit within me.'

And for a NT reference:-

Titus 3:4-5. 'But when the kindness and the love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit.'

What is the New Birth? It is a birth of water and Spirit, washing and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

I do not think the idea of the 'water' as a picture of a physical birth really works. The Lord Jesus goes on to say, 'That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.' Here He is talking of 'flesh' not 'water' as meaning physical birth. I do not think He would mix His metaphors in that way.

Bishop Ryle has an excellent treatment of this passage in the notes to his 'Expository thoughts on John' Vol 1 (Banner of Truth). John Murray is also good ('Redempton Accomplished and Applied').

Blessings to all,
Steve