|

|
|
|
Posts: 15,027
Joined: April 2001
|
|
|
|
Forums31
Topics8,351
Posts56,547
Members992
| |
Most Online4,295 Yesterday at 09:40 PM
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 15,027 Likes: 274
Head Honcho
|
Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 15,027 Likes: 274 |
grace2U said: The real difference between credo- and paedo-baptists is their starting point. If you start with Abraham, you inevitably end up imposing the promise upon the reality, the shadow upon the substance which is Christ (Col 2:17 ). <big cut> 'The New Covenant starts with the cross (Luke 22:20). The Covenant of Grace was made in eternity between the Father and the Son for the redemption of mankind (Eph 1:3ff). We are in this covenant as the elect who are in Christ (See Larger Catechism Q.31). I perceive some confusion here on your part: 1) Paedobaptists don't start with Abraham, in regard to the Covenant of Grace (CoG) but with Adam. (Gen 3:15) 2) The CoG was NOT made in eternity, but in time. The "Covenant of Redemption, aka: Covenant of Peace, was established in eternity between the Father and Son (Holy Spirit implied), which was the expression of God's eternal decree to save the elect. The Father predestinates, the Son agrees to atone for those predestined and to send forth the Holy Spirit to apply the benefits of that atonement upon those who the Father predestined. The CoG was the establishment of that eternal covenant with the elect in time, beginning with Adam and all the godly seed. The hermeneutical issue is inextricably bound to one's Biblical Theology. Historic CT sees the CoG as progressive; beginning with Adam and continuing throughout all history until the last man is redeemed. Throughout that history, until the coming of Christ, God unfolded the specifics of that covenant in various ways, each emphasizing one or more aspects/facets of it and thus unveiling more and more of its "mystery". The "new covenant" simply brought about a fuller expression of that one CoG and with it came a fullness, albeit in part, of it's understanding. In its "old covenant" form, there were various elements which reflected upon the types and shadows of its essence. And likewise, in the "new covenant" form those elements reflect its greater fullness. For example, the looking forward to the shedding of blood was shown in the covenant sign of circumcision of the "old administration" of the covenant, in anticipation. And in the "new administration" of the covenant, its sign of baptism looks back upon what that shedding of blood accomplished from the aspect of completion. The CoG has to do with the "spiritual seed", i.e., the elect of God. Too many Baptists conflate physical Israel with the seed, the same mistake, albeit not to the same degree, as did the Jews of Jesus' day. There has always been and always will be two lines that exist within the human race. But there is only one covenant of grace from which the promise of salvation was given and is applied to those whom God had eternally predestined to salvation. In His Grace,
simul iustus et peccator
|
|
|
|
|
Entire Thread
|
Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Anonymous
|
Sat Mar 19, 2005 2:30 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:07 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Anonymous
|
Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:25 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:25 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Anonymous
|
Tue Mar 22, 2005 11:55 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:06 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
fredman
|
Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:47 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Wed Mar 30, 2005 12:50 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:26 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:08 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Pilgrim
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 1:21 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 5:24 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Pilgrim
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:31 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 10:07 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 11:24 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Fri Apr 01, 2005 12:08 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:41 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Fri Apr 01, 2005 11:15 PM
|
Covenant of Redemption
|
J_Edwards
|
Sat Apr 02, 2005 12:07 AM
|
Covenant of Redemption?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sun Apr 03, 2005 1:29 AM
|
Re: Covenant of Redemption?
|
grace2U
|
Sun Apr 03, 2005 9:41 AM
|
Re: Covenant of Redemption?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sun Apr 03, 2005 1:51 PM
|
Re: Covenant of Redemption?
|
grace2U
|
Sun Apr 10, 2005 10:50 PM
|
Re: Covenant of Redemption?
|
J_Edwards
|
Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:20 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 11:02 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Pilgrim
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 11:52 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Fri Apr 01, 2005 3:43 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Pilgrim
|
Fri Apr 01, 2005 11:33 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Sat Apr 02, 2005 11:09 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Peter
|
Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:08 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
fredman
|
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:23 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Tue Apr 05, 2005 4:38 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 4:44 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 11:54 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Fri Apr 01, 2005 12:00 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Wed Apr 20, 2005 9:15 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Wes
|
Wed Apr 20, 2005 7:09 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Wed Apr 20, 2005 11:36 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Fri Apr 22, 2005 3:36 PM
|
Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sat Apr 23, 2005 3:41 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Sat Apr 23, 2005 1:27 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Sat Apr 23, 2005 4:20 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sat Apr 23, 2005 6:32 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Sat May 14, 2005 1:35 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sat May 14, 2005 10:39 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sat Apr 23, 2005 4:35 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Fri May 13, 2005 9:21 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Fri May 13, 2005 1:14 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
BradJHammond
|
Fri May 13, 2005 2:49 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Fri May 13, 2005 3:44 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Peter
|
Sat May 14, 2005 5:24 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Sun May 15, 2005 10:48 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Sun May 15, 2005 11:00 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Sun May 15, 2005 11:48 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Mon May 16, 2005 12:20 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Mon May 16, 2005 4:02 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Anonymous
|
Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:22 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
Tom
|
Fri Mar 25, 2005 7:02 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
fredman
|
Fri Mar 25, 2005 2:35 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Sat Mar 26, 2005 1:48 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
fredman
|
Mon Mar 28, 2005 1:27 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
J_Edwards
|
Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:50 PM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
grace2U
|
Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:47 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
sixcannons
|
Thu Mar 31, 2005 1:42 AM
|
Re: Fred Malone a dispensationalist?
|
William
|
Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:16 AM
|
|
|
|
0 members (),
103
guests, and
33
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
|
|
|
|
1
|
2
|
|
3
|
4
|
5
|
6
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
|
10
|
11
|
12
|
13
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
|
17
|
18
|
19
|
20
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
|
24
|
25
|
26
|
27
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
|
31
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|