In reply to:
[color:"blue"] I too would be interested in some views on this as a former (still ?) hyper-calvinist....I am having great difficulty shedding the Hyper aspect for fear of embracing Arminianism.

Howard, I truly respect you and "some" of your views. You are one of the most generous individuals I have ever had the pleasure of knowing. But, (and not so much unlike myself at times..for which I have repented and continue to examine myself) you are sometimes cruel (at times unknowingly so) because of a lack of understanding of some important concepts. Let us look at some of the hyper tendencies, such as All Arminians are Unsaved, which appears to come out in your posts.

There are many things that one could say about this issue, All Arminians are Unsaved (ps: some Calvinists are too), and if one said them all, then nothing would be said..(it would be loss in the ruble).....Thus, I will just make a few brief points for your consideration.

    1. From personal experience, I was an Arminian and practiced such when I was first saved. I did not know doctrine, know the Scriptures, only what I was being taught. BUT, I was SAVED! All Arminians are not lost as your posts seem to suggest.

    2. As I grew in the Scriptures (and thus my knowledge of God and His ways), this naturally this led me to the proper theology of Calvinism (this took years). Though when I was born again, I WAS born as a Calvinist (election), I DID NOT come to the "fuller" understanding of this till later (still growing). This is an important point: in a manner of speaking, there is a separation in being saved from how one may think they were saved (John 3:8). We DO NOT understand it all !! [/LIST] The problem with "some" Calvinists is they think to EMBRACE an Arminian is to embrace his theology as well--this is not the truth though. An Arminian may EMBRACE the Apostle's Creed (though not completely understanding it) and one is hard pressed to say this person is lost (without much more evidence), IMHO. The Apostle's Creed, IMHO, is a better tool from which to begin embracing others from "various beliefs" and then attempt to teach them from that perspective. We must break with the "idea" that we are the only right church mentality in the evaluation of other's salvation (specifically, if you are not a Calvinist you are lost), when they embrace such things as the Apostle's Creed, et. el......theology, YES (more so, but not perfect is it?), salvation no. We must strive for "some unity" in the body of Christ without violating the theology that is true.

    Now with this said, to tell an Arminian who embraces the Apostle's Creed, he is not saved (with no other "individual" discerning facts) is assumption on your part. Blasting his theology in love is one thing, attacking his salvation is another. In the process of dealing with his theology you and he may discover that he was not saved in the first place, but this cannot be done initially--Calvinists are not God! Then again, because of your love of sharing the truth of Scripture with him he may grow in grace and truth and finally embrace Calvinism. I gave away your two books (Calvinism Pure and Mixed & The Sovereignty of God) "yesterday" and I already have another scheduled appointment with this Arminian to discuss one of the books he finished last night. I accepted him where he was at and I am attempting to bring him to a fuller understanding of the Gospel. I am fully convinced he is saved and just lacking in understanding. But, had I looked at him and said, "YOUR LOST, you don't believe in Calvinism".......(1) I would have been a liar (2) I do not think we would be communicating so well now?

    Now, this is only a partial thought and I hope you or others will not take it out of context! And please do not take offense at what I am attempting to get across. I mean this in the most loving and respectful way I can express it at this moment in time. May God have mercy.

Reformed and Always Reforming,