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Robin said:
I too was regenerated, converted, adopted, sanctified, and sealed long before I discovered and converted to Calvinism.

I would like to believe that what Beloved57 is trying to say is that sooner or later those who are truly regenerate inevitably become Calvinists, as surely as the regenerate inevitably confess Christ as Lord openly.

But reading post after post from Beloved57, he appears to be saying that a person has neither heard nor responded to Christ at all until and unless they were presented with the Five Points of Calvinism. Anything less is, to Beloved57, a false gospel and thus anyone who is not Calvinist isn't really saved.

You can't have it both ways. But the point is that belief in Calvinism does not save anyone. The gospel is a message about Jesus, not a technical manual describing how His work is applied to the elect; in what order the various aspects of salvation occur in time; when and how the Father chose the Elect, etc. The gospel is not a message about justification by faith, but that message about Jesus. When that message is received and believed by God-given faith resulting from regeneration, a person is converted and truly eternally saved. Even if they don't understand all the technical manuals.

Ligten up, Beloved57!

Saved before Calvinism,
Robin

Robin:

Darryl is proposing some form of doctrinal regeneration. He does not believe that believing in TULIP saves you. But it is nuanced into a form of immediate knowledge upon regeneration. It is the same error as the ones who would say you must speak in tongues in order to prove you are saved. Darryl uses doctrine as a proof of ones regeneration. Now there is some truth to this method of thinking. Like I said earlier, one cannot profess to be regenerated and deny the fact that Christ came in the flesh. One cannot be regenerated while confessing Christ is not the messiah.

I wil also point out that "Calvinism" as a term defining the Sovereignty of GOD in the Salvation of His people is as old as Genesis 1:1. So the teachings were present long before John Calvin.

What Darryl would do is to have a questionnaire for people who profess to be "saved'. And if they do not confess the 5 petals, he feels he can determine them unregenerate. Not damned, but unregenerate. The phrase "manifest" your regenerancy/salvation is used as a cloak for this understanding. This error has plagued the church for history. It is nothing new. The pharises were guilty of this, the early church was guilty of this, the reformers and puritans were guilty of this. It is a subtle form of navel gazing. What has happenned is people have perverted the inspired Peter who wrote; "Make your election and calling sure" Into saying "Make everyone elses election and calling sure. It is a form of experiential salvation. The puritans did this a lot also. They would look at ones life and circumstances and determine if that person was blessed of God. A good crop meant they were in good standing. etc etc etc. Just like Job's "friends" who "knew" job was being punished for some unconfessed sin.

This behavior is totally subjective and takes a truth of scripture and tweeks it just enough to confuse people. The greatest deception the devil can pull is to give "his" interpretation of God's word which is very rarely an outright bold faced lie. Deception is always cloaked with shreds of truth.

There never was a sinner half as big as Christ is as a Savior.